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The Future of Subwoofers?


13 replies to this topic

#1
Souldrop

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Hey all, 

 

As I was working tonight I started to think about the advances car audio has seen in the past couple of decades. It amazes me to think that amps and the technology in amps have come so far, but it seems to me that subs have very little that could be improved upon. As the years go by and amps produce more and more power it seems subs just get bigger motors and bulkier voice coils to handle the increased power. Am I missing something? Is it just working from a larger motor and trying to design around it? Are there truly no innovative ideas out there because there is nothing to improve on as far as the tech involved because of a loudspeakers simplicity or are the innovations so subtle that I have failed to notice them?

 

btw I have a good amount of respect for EE's for advancing the car audio culture in the ways they have. I had to take an electronics course for my physics BS and that was the most tedious, painful class I took and we didn't even scratch the surface. 


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#2
revoracing247

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the way i see it, the subs have advanced to take the increases in power so they can more violently move the air. lol and the new sundown zv.4 series i honestly think is pretty cool. they have spent so much time on the suspension and stuff with it that i think that's probably where subs are gonna move. i mean there's like no shift in T/S parameters when it's at high excursion!

 

p.s. im an EE student right now and i love all my EE classes lol


 

I think you have a bit of truck stuck in your mud bro

 

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#3
Krakin

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There are many new technologies coming out with surrounds, cone compositions, spider materials, magnet material, and other advances to lower mechanical noise.

 

A problem for mass market is that when a new composition or designed cone/diaphragm comes out it is normally kept to the company that designed it.


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Krakin, are you some sort of mad scientist?

 
 

I would have replied earlier, but I was measuring the output of my amp with a yardstick . . .

 
 
 

What you hear is not the air pressure variation in itself 
but what has drawn your attention
in the two streams of superimposed air pressure variations at your eardrums

 

An acoustic event has dimensions of Time, Tone, Loudness and Space


#4
Audiofanaticz

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It comes down to R&D, and sadly a lot of companies dont do to much of that..

Your always going to be limited by certain things, even if they do design a big motor, or even a strong motor thats smaller.

Things like the 12spoke baskets for instance, theres limits on what you can all do excursion wise with it, or the same model cone that one company has been using for 5-10 years without change, even spiders which several manufactures use the same one and theres nothing special about them besides something like reliably.

 

Sundown for example is going above and beyond any other woofer manufacture just for that reason, pushing things farther, by having countless prototypes, and changes to prototypes, Tooling up your own surrounds, cones, spiders, baskets, and motors. Dont think there is really any other company that is doing things to that extent (and by that I mean using parts that no other manufacture is using).



#5
Krakin

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It comes down to R&D, and sadly a lot of companies dont do to much of that..


This got me thinking about Audax and their cone designs. They have many generations of each driver, and in the case of their HD-Aerogel 6.5" model that has reached its 18th gen.


Also has anyone had any experience with any of their drivers?

Edited by Krakin, 31 October 2013 - 12:06 AM.

b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png

Krakin's Home Dipole Project 
http://www.stevemead...e/#entry2772370
 
 

Krakin, are you some sort of mad scientist?

 
 

I would have replied earlier, but I was measuring the output of my amp with a yardstick . . .

 
 
 

What you hear is not the air pressure variation in itself 
but what has drawn your attention
in the two streams of superimposed air pressure variations at your eardrums

 

An acoustic event has dimensions of Time, Tone, Loudness and Space


#6
STEALTH808

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Thats why the patent system needs to be changed. 


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#7
Souldrop

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Apparently I need to look into some of what Sundown has been up to. I have only dealt with them a few years ago when I purchased a couple amps Jacob was discontinuing. I figured there would be advance in materials that would affect subwoofers, but assumed it would be more of trickle down effect from R&D not car audio related that would take a long while to be seen at the mass consumer level. I'm actually surprised that so many manufacturers seem to use the same parts. I would figure that they would tweak the sizes of the raw materials to be different from their competitors.

 

Krakin - No, I haven't even heard of Audax; I will definitely look into them. A new cone design sounds like it could be interesting. That's one area where I would think someone would have tried several different designs, especially with the popularity of Kicker's square subs.

 

Revo, you have to be crazy to go into EE imho lol.


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#8
Souldrop

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I was under the impression that Audax was changing cone shape not material, but still sounds cool. 


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#9
gmsierra2000

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I too have a BS, but im done yaaayy no more school!!!! it only so much you can do to a sub to make it more efficient. unless the can create a better copper wire to wind around the voice coil it going to be the same for a while. what they need to do is find a speaker shape that can move extreme amounts of air, I wonder why speaker creaters didn't merge to the square concept of the solo baric speakers as a platform. to what I hear they do move great amount of air cause of the shape.



#10
Souldrop

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Yeah, I don't know why there doesn't seem to be any other cone designs. I would personally like to see a dimpled cone tried, but maybe that would cause some wave cancellation?


Edited by Souldrop, 31 October 2013 - 10:39 AM.

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#11
B-Sh0t

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Yeah, I don't know why there doesn't seem to be any other cone designs. I would personally like to see a dimpled cone tried, but maybe that would cause some wave cancellation?

http://www.sony.co.u...ge/car-speakers,



#12
Souldrop

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Damn it had to be sony....


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#13
truthsayer

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If you watch nova, there have been some very cool advances coming to the electronic industry. One of the coolest is cold lead infused steal. which is 900 percent more efficient than copper. It's some pretty cool shit what they are learning they can do with the 0 kelvin technologies. But i would expect due to cost at the present it will be 10 yrs before we see any benefits in the audio world. 


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#14
Audiofanaticz

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 I wonder why speaker creaters didn't merge to the square concept of the solo baric speakers as a platform. to what I hear they do move great amount of air cause of the shape.

 

 

 

Because square speakers have square voice coils, and can only be powered by square waves..

  Which makes it insanely expensive to manufacture square woofers.....

:P

 

Seriously tho, the slight gain of cone area from a square woofer to a round woofer is not worth it.

The square woofers have 90degree corners, which means 90 degree surrounds in said corners, and it limits the xmax of the driver especially at higher excursion due to the lack of movement on the inner half of the surround in the corners (closest to the cone).

Ive seen many square style woofers besides kicker with surrounds that have came unattached.

 

The size of the cone does not matter as much as people think it does, (meaning a 12 inch square vs a 12 inch round woofer).

 

If it came down to the amount of cone area on said woofer, and that was the factor in moving more air, that would result in any 12 inch round woofer not being able to move as much air as said square woofer, and thats far from true or even being plausible.





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