Surhoff88 Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 I was watching a new video from JacobViral on youtube and I heard something that got me thinking. The guy in the video said he inverted his subs because the double or tripple baffle he had was blocking too much air flow coming from the cone. The baffle extended a couple inches down the basket covering a large ares that wasnt allowing air to get by thus hurting his output. At least thats how i understood what he said. So he inverted the subs and gained 4 db i think he said, sounded so much better. So what do you guys think about that? The guy in the video is right about a thick baffle covering up 1.5" or 2.25" of the basket, but the rest Im not sold on yet. I am still unsure how that would inhibit bass output but anyone got any thoughts they wanna share. Heres the video https://youtu.be/4cBmnkIkCI0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiofanaticz Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 It can be a very big issue especially on smaller sub sizes like 12 inch subs and smaller. Also even a bigger issue on some baskets more than others such as the TI/TC style 12 inch baskets, or even copy cat baskets that are poorly designed. Not really an issue with the older style 12 spoke, or 4 and 6 spoke baskets. This issue can be increased even more when said woofers use spider spacers since that raises the height of the spider pack, and on some subs that could be another 1/4-1/2 inch or more. You can calculate cone displacement and then measure out the open area of the basket and figure out that area to see if its an issue with your particular woofer, some are more than others. This is one reason you do a flush mount when using a double baffle, your essentially getting all the strength of the full 2 layer thick baffle but you are not suffocating the woofer. Other things can be done to improve the air flow around the woofer as well such as rounding over the inside of the baffle. As for the gains it may or not make is going to vary, part of that vary will be when you invert a subwoofer your physically increasing that box volume a good 1/2 cube on some of your larger woofers, which results in making the enclosure more efficient with the same amount of power. Granted these gains wont be noticeable by the ear, and only a spl meter. I have a pic someplace with the TI/TC style basket. Edit, I found the pic sooner than I expected.. Here is a 12 inch TI/TC basket with what would be a 3 layer baffle, even if you go with a 2 layer baffle you can draw an imaginary line where the 2nd baffle ends and see how much is being blocked off. i also shared this with a Foxracing (iirc) on Team Asshole from Canada https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4zsol1a_So that is on the forums that was always having cone issues in his build with 8 12s that used this style baffle and he never thought to think about it. I know he said he was going to do some testing on it but never knew if he done anything or not. So another edit on the spaced spider thing I mentioned. Here is another 12 inch sub that is using the same TI/TC style basket with spaced spiders. You can see the plastic ring that the spiders are now attached to which is sitting up much higher than the above pics which is reducing that gap even more. At this point a single baffle will probably be enough to impact performance in some way let alone a double baffle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocking.that.eclipse Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 We talked about this a while ago (Brian) I like that the TI basket can fit a larger spider than the 12 spoke. Companies like Sundown and DC that have gone to custom tooled baskets are going the right way. Now I just wish that FI would do that too. They have a proto of something but its just that.... proto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triticum Agricolam Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 This issue isn't just limited to subs, it can be quite a problem for some mid range drivers. When building home theater enclosures I usually add a roundover between the mounting screw holes like this: With subs I'll often use a big 45 degree chamfer on the inside layer to give the back of the cone more room to breath. "Nothing prevents people from knowing the truth more than the belief they already know it.""Making bass is easy, making music is the hard part."Builds: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surhoff88 Posted November 29, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2018 Ive always been a proponent of double or tripple baffles when the subs being used are 70, 80, 100lbs each. I always like there to be more material for the threads of the fastener to bite into and more area to spread the load as all that mass hangs perpendicular to the baffle. It is almost a neccessary evil, unless tee nuts or another metal insert is used. Those could use less baffle. So bigger drivers, 15" for example, are not affected as much. Great Im a 12s lover, i love 15s too, i just never have the space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will77530 Posted November 29, 2018 Report Share Posted November 29, 2018 Brian has a lot of good point but the size of the magnet plays a huge part of that as well. If the magnet is blocking the majority of the back wave you are just going to run into problems as well. i believe this is the reason dc audio doesn’t make a lv 6 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CstrokerV Posted November 30, 2018 Report Share Posted November 30, 2018 20 hours ago, will77530 said: Brian has a lot of good point but the size of the magnet plays a huge part of that as well. If the magnet is blocking the majority of the back wave you are just going to run into problems as well. i believe this is the reason dc audio doesn’t make a lv 6 12 Among other issues I think there was a couple made with buyer beware and one of those people got pissed off because it did what dc said it probably will do lol. my build http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/board/topic/142505-small-build-log-4-dc-lvl3-10s-tl-update-link-to-rebuild/ http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/board/topic/154258-rebuild-6-lvl3-12s-update-small-video-nothing-spectacular/ new build http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/board/topic/188181-03-trailblazer-slow-build-8-dc-lvl3-12-m1-motor-m2-parts/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyblack76 Posted November 30, 2018 Report Share Posted November 30, 2018 4 db gain is a ton. And the way he says it,.. no actual numbers, "probably, uh, around, uh.. 4db" .. I'm not buying that large of a gain. Just me. With out score pics and just the way they are speaking,.. I dont by a plus 4db gain. He probably saw most of a "gain" or improvement, getting more cubes outta the enclosure, and slightly adjusting freq. Suppose anything is possible tho. In the lanes, I dont see a lot invert, so if there is a "monster gain" its pretty apparent, like everything, its build specific. SMD SUPER SELLER The Burban Build Blazer Build sold Acura trunk build sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiBo Posted November 30, 2018 Report Share Posted November 30, 2018 Two baffles for the sub to mount too and the third baffle surrounds the outside of the woofer. Problem solved. You get the strength of 2.25" of total baffle with only 1.5" of mounting depth. I'm building an enclosure for 2-18's like this rt now lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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