Jump to content

3 way active setup, need advice on amp selection


b2sdad

Recommended Posts

17 minutes ago, b2sdad said:

Looks like i still have a ton of research to do. I didn't realize a three way active setup was so detailed. 

My first active setup back in the day was A/6/S 641's, you should have seen how many holes i cut for my midrange until i got it right lmao.. It took me a couple months of just settings and driver location alone.

When you go active, especially moving from a high end passive crossover to digital, you are removing certain things that could hurt certain setups.

The Q of the set is altered, the woofer/mid phase gets set back to 0, the tweet resistor gone, requiring a MUCH smaller amp, you might have bypassed a baffle step and/or zobel circuit ect..

Depending on the drivers capability and how well it plays in your vehicle, sometimes you need to compromise for these things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 46
  • Created
  • Last Reply

problem is, there aren't a lot of shops around my area that can really help. As soon as I walk in and mention active setup, they begin to stutter and start sweating?

The last shop I went to said they could install a 6 channel, but if i wanted to use a DSP they could sell me one, but they would have call somebody else to tune the it ? All the while saying we are authorized dealers for (Brand A, or Brand Z ) How do you become an authorized dealer and NOT know how to operate the products you sell? I asked how they tune all the other cars they work on? The reply I got was, we tune by ear! Heck I could do that, what the heck I am here for then??? I asked  if they used an RTA, an O-Scope, DD-1, They said no we don't? The problem is this has happened to me at least three shops local to me. 

2006 Nissan Titan Crew Cab

XS Power D6500 up front, Mechman 270 amp alt, 

Front Stage:Hybrid Audio Legatia Tweeters and Midrange drivers in Custom A Pillars, HA Unity 6x9 inch Midbass in the doors, powered by an Arc Audio 1200.6 X2 and connected to a JL TWK 88 DSP

Subwoofers: Four 8 inch Soundqubed Subs in a ported enclosure. Incriminator Audio 20.1 on the subs (@ 1ohm) 

Performance: JBA Headers, Uprev Tuned, Dynomax bullet muffler, 3 inch exhaust all the way back. Air raid CAI.

Wheels: 18 inch Balistic Jester wheels on 33 inch Nitto TG2's

Suspension: 6 inches of lift total. DK UCA's, DK LCA's, Icon coilovers up front, Bilstein Shocks in the rear with 4 inch blocks 

 

2007 Chevy Suburban LTZ

Engine: 5.3 DOD Delete, BTR Stage 4 truck Cam, TSP Headers, Gibson Catback exhaust. Tuned by Sam @ Advanced Modern Performance.

Suspension: 2/4 Belkin drop. Belkin Sway bars, Spohn Panhard bar

Audio: Pioneer 8400 NEX Head unit, Audio Dynamics DSP, 6th order enclosure with three 10 inch DC Audio Level 4s behind the third row. Wolfram 4500 on Subs, Wolfram AW 250.4 on the front stage Dual SkyHigh Car Audio 8 inch mid bass in the doors, quad 3.5 inch midrange drivers in the A-Pillars 

Dual Alternators, Mechman 320 powering a CES 40ah Lithium battery, OEM alt has an AGM on it.Viper remote start.

 

Wheels:  24 inch Luxx wheels/ 305/40 R24

Grammatically speaking, Prolly is not a word.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, b2sdad said:

problem is, there aren't a lot of shops around my area that can really help. As soon as I walk in and mention active setup, they begin to stutter and start sweating?

The last shop I went to said they could install a 6 channel, but if i wanted to use a DSP they could sell me one, but they would have call somebody else to tune the it ? All the while saying we are authorized dealers for (Brand A, or Brand Z ) How do you become an authorized dealer and NOT know how to operate the products you sell? I asked how they tune all the other cars they work on? The reply I got was, we tune by ear! Heck I could do that, what the heck I am here for then??? I asked  if they used an RTA, an O-Scope, DD-1, They said no we don't? The problem is this has happened to me at least three shops local to me. 

If youve never done this before and shops wont help. I suggest 2 way active with a pioneer 80prs headunit.  Plenty of eq to learn on. And wont need a dsp yet

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, ToNasty said:

If youve never done this before and shops wont help. I suggest 2 way active with a pioneer 80prs headunit.  Plenty of eq to learn on. And wont need a dsp yet

Well, I am trying to use my existing equipment. I already have the Hybrid Audio gear installed, I know the crossover recommendations HA suggests for these speakers... So I guess after I choose my amplifier and dsp combo, I will have to do my own tuning. I just hope nothing goes wrong.  

2006 Nissan Titan Crew Cab

XS Power D6500 up front, Mechman 270 amp alt, 

Front Stage:Hybrid Audio Legatia Tweeters and Midrange drivers in Custom A Pillars, HA Unity 6x9 inch Midbass in the doors, powered by an Arc Audio 1200.6 X2 and connected to a JL TWK 88 DSP

Subwoofers: Four 8 inch Soundqubed Subs in a ported enclosure. Incriminator Audio 20.1 on the subs (@ 1ohm) 

Performance: JBA Headers, Uprev Tuned, Dynomax bullet muffler, 3 inch exhaust all the way back. Air raid CAI.

Wheels: 18 inch Balistic Jester wheels on 33 inch Nitto TG2's

Suspension: 6 inches of lift total. DK UCA's, DK LCA's, Icon coilovers up front, Bilstein Shocks in the rear with 4 inch blocks 

 

2007 Chevy Suburban LTZ

Engine: 5.3 DOD Delete, BTR Stage 4 truck Cam, TSP Headers, Gibson Catback exhaust. Tuned by Sam @ Advanced Modern Performance.

Suspension: 2/4 Belkin drop. Belkin Sway bars, Spohn Panhard bar

Audio: Pioneer 8400 NEX Head unit, Audio Dynamics DSP, 6th order enclosure with three 10 inch DC Audio Level 4s behind the third row. Wolfram 4500 on Subs, Wolfram AW 250.4 on the front stage Dual SkyHigh Car Audio 8 inch mid bass in the doors, quad 3.5 inch midrange drivers in the A-Pillars 

Dual Alternators, Mechman 320 powering a CES 40ah Lithium battery, OEM alt has an AGM on it.Viper remote start.

 

Wheels:  24 inch Luxx wheels/ 305/40 R24

Grammatically speaking, Prolly is not a word.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, b2sdad said:

problem is, there aren't a lot of shops around my area that can really help. As soon as I walk in and mention active setup, they begin to stutter and start sweating?

The last shop I went to said they could install a 6 channel, but if i wanted to use a DSP they could sell me one, but they would have call somebody else to tune the it ? All the while saying we are authorized dealers for (Brand A, or Brand Z ) How do you become an authorized dealer and NOT know how to operate the products you sell? I asked how they tune all the other cars they work on? The reply I got was, we tune by ear! Heck I could do that, what the heck I am here for then??? I asked  if they used an RTA, an O-Scope, DD-1, They said no we don't? The problem is this has happened to me at least three shops local to me. 

I’ve been competing car Audio (Sound Quality and Sound Pressure) for years and I never use any of that stuff. It’s simple if you pay attention, learn, and know what you are doing.

it’s simple really. Tuning starts with the source unit. Learn it’s limits. Then the network. Phase, crossover points, alignment measurement, and system goals. People in the old days tune by ear because that’s all they had and most stay true to their roots. Like me, I operate equipment like I was trained. If you listen to actual music, your system will easily tell you where it’s limits are. Have patience with your system.

 

Kenwood / HELIX / Linear Power (For The Love Of Music) / Brutal Sounds / OverKill Electric Co 

Questions About Sound Quality ?? Try Here ... Sound Quality, What does it REALLY mean ?? 

SMD SOTM Winner "White Lightning" 1997 GMT400 Chevy Silverado   

"The Green Dickle" 1994 GMT400 Chevy "Phantom Dually"   

Randal's 2007 Chevy Avalanche (we haven't named this one yet)

Dylan's "Brutal" 17 Chevy Cruze RS Hatch                         

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, White Lightning said:

I’ve been competing car Audio (Sound Quality and Sound Pressure) for years and I never use any of that stuff. It’s simple if you pay attention, learn, and know what you are doing.

it’s simple really. Tuning starts with the source unit. Learn it’s limits. Then the network. Phase, crossover points, alignment measurement, and system goals. People in the old days tune by ear because that’s all they had and most stay true to their roots. Like me, I operate equipment like I was trained. If you listen to actual music, your system will easily tell you where it’s limits are. Have patience with your system.

 

For sure, I am trying to read and understand as much as I can. I also used to compete in SPL competitions way back in the day. This is my first attempt to have a decent front stage in any one of my vehicles. I am used to to slapping a few sets of components in my ride and being done with it. Never being concerned, staging, clarity or imaging. As a basshhead, well you can guess its all about the bass! I am a little older now and want to refine the system I have.

As far as tuning by ear, I can say that was fine if that was all that was available back when. I guess I had a bad experience before in the past where a shop tuned my system by "EAR" and did a lousy job! I had my vehicle put on an RTA at another shop because I didn't sound right to me at all, turns out two out of the four mid bass woofers I was running were out of phase and the RTA looked horribly crooked once pink noise was played through the system. The shop did some adjustments got me a nice flat response on the RTA , fixed my out of phase woofers and the difference was amazing. I don't trust peoples ears, I need measurable, verifiable data.   

2006 Nissan Titan Crew Cab

XS Power D6500 up front, Mechman 270 amp alt, 

Front Stage:Hybrid Audio Legatia Tweeters and Midrange drivers in Custom A Pillars, HA Unity 6x9 inch Midbass in the doors, powered by an Arc Audio 1200.6 X2 and connected to a JL TWK 88 DSP

Subwoofers: Four 8 inch Soundqubed Subs in a ported enclosure. Incriminator Audio 20.1 on the subs (@ 1ohm) 

Performance: JBA Headers, Uprev Tuned, Dynomax bullet muffler, 3 inch exhaust all the way back. Air raid CAI.

Wheels: 18 inch Balistic Jester wheels on 33 inch Nitto TG2's

Suspension: 6 inches of lift total. DK UCA's, DK LCA's, Icon coilovers up front, Bilstein Shocks in the rear with 4 inch blocks 

 

2007 Chevy Suburban LTZ

Engine: 5.3 DOD Delete, BTR Stage 4 truck Cam, TSP Headers, Gibson Catback exhaust. Tuned by Sam @ Advanced Modern Performance.

Suspension: 2/4 Belkin drop. Belkin Sway bars, Spohn Panhard bar

Audio: Pioneer 8400 NEX Head unit, Audio Dynamics DSP, 6th order enclosure with three 10 inch DC Audio Level 4s behind the third row. Wolfram 4500 on Subs, Wolfram AW 250.4 on the front stage Dual SkyHigh Car Audio 8 inch mid bass in the doors, quad 3.5 inch midrange drivers in the A-Pillars 

Dual Alternators, Mechman 320 powering a CES 40ah Lithium battery, OEM alt has an AGM on it.Viper remote start.

 

Wheels:  24 inch Luxx wheels/ 305/40 R24

Grammatically speaking, Prolly is not a word.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/25/2019 at 10:18 AM, CrackFactory said:

This is true of a lot of smaller shops. When I first started at my shop they didn't have any nice tuning equipment either and they have been in business over 40 years! You will need to find a high end shop to get what you want.

I believe you are absolutely correct Sir!

 

2006 Nissan Titan Crew Cab

XS Power D6500 up front, Mechman 270 amp alt, 

Front Stage:Hybrid Audio Legatia Tweeters and Midrange drivers in Custom A Pillars, HA Unity 6x9 inch Midbass in the doors, powered by an Arc Audio 1200.6 X2 and connected to a JL TWK 88 DSP

Subwoofers: Four 8 inch Soundqubed Subs in a ported enclosure. Incriminator Audio 20.1 on the subs (@ 1ohm) 

Performance: JBA Headers, Uprev Tuned, Dynomax bullet muffler, 3 inch exhaust all the way back. Air raid CAI.

Wheels: 18 inch Balistic Jester wheels on 33 inch Nitto TG2's

Suspension: 6 inches of lift total. DK UCA's, DK LCA's, Icon coilovers up front, Bilstein Shocks in the rear with 4 inch blocks 

 

2007 Chevy Suburban LTZ

Engine: 5.3 DOD Delete, BTR Stage 4 truck Cam, TSP Headers, Gibson Catback exhaust. Tuned by Sam @ Advanced Modern Performance.

Suspension: 2/4 Belkin drop. Belkin Sway bars, Spohn Panhard bar

Audio: Pioneer 8400 NEX Head unit, Audio Dynamics DSP, 6th order enclosure with three 10 inch DC Audio Level 4s behind the third row. Wolfram 4500 on Subs, Wolfram AW 250.4 on the front stage Dual SkyHigh Car Audio 8 inch mid bass in the doors, quad 3.5 inch midrange drivers in the A-Pillars 

Dual Alternators, Mechman 320 powering a CES 40ah Lithium battery, OEM alt has an AGM on it.Viper remote start.

 

Wheels:  24 inch Luxx wheels/ 305/40 R24

Grammatically speaking, Prolly is not a word.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, b2sdad said:

For sure, I am trying to read and understand as much as I can. I also used to compete in SPL competitions way back in the day. This is my first attempt to have a decent front stage in any one of my vehicles. I am used to to slapping a few sets of components in my ride and being done with it. Never being concerned, staging, clarity or imaging. As a basshhead, well you can guess its all about the bass! I am a little older now and want to refine the system I have.

As far as tuning by ear, I can say that was fine if that was all that was available back when. I guess I had a bad experience before in the past where a shop tuned my system by "EAR" and did a lousy job! I had my vehicle put on an RTA at another shop because I didn't sound right to me at all, turns out two out of the four mid bass woofers I was running were out of phase and the RTA looked horribly crooked once pink noise was played through the system. The shop did some adjustments got me a nice flat response on the RTA , fixed my out of phase woofers and the difference was amazing. I don't trust peoples ears, I need measurable, verifiable data.   

I have a link on my sig that may help with better understanding of Sound Quality.

You are correct, a lot of shops do lousy work cause improper phase adjustment is installer error. plain and simple. Something that can be easily set up without the RTA.

Kenwood / HELIX / Linear Power (For The Love Of Music) / Brutal Sounds / OverKill Electric Co 

Questions About Sound Quality ?? Try Here ... Sound Quality, What does it REALLY mean ?? 

SMD SOTM Winner "White Lightning" 1997 GMT400 Chevy Silverado   

"The Green Dickle" 1994 GMT400 Chevy "Phantom Dually"   

Randal's 2007 Chevy Avalanche (we haven't named this one yet)

Dylan's "Brutal" 17 Chevy Cruze RS Hatch                         

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, White Lightning said:

I have a link on my sig that may help with better understanding of Sound Quality.

You are correct, a lot of shops do lousy work cause improper phase adjustment is installer error. plain and simple. Something that can be easily set up without the RTA.

I will check out your link for some more SQ Knowledge! Thank you Sir!

2006 Nissan Titan Crew Cab

XS Power D6500 up front, Mechman 270 amp alt, 

Front Stage:Hybrid Audio Legatia Tweeters and Midrange drivers in Custom A Pillars, HA Unity 6x9 inch Midbass in the doors, powered by an Arc Audio 1200.6 X2 and connected to a JL TWK 88 DSP

Subwoofers: Four 8 inch Soundqubed Subs in a ported enclosure. Incriminator Audio 20.1 on the subs (@ 1ohm) 

Performance: JBA Headers, Uprev Tuned, Dynomax bullet muffler, 3 inch exhaust all the way back. Air raid CAI.

Wheels: 18 inch Balistic Jester wheels on 33 inch Nitto TG2's

Suspension: 6 inches of lift total. DK UCA's, DK LCA's, Icon coilovers up front, Bilstein Shocks in the rear with 4 inch blocks 

 

2007 Chevy Suburban LTZ

Engine: 5.3 DOD Delete, BTR Stage 4 truck Cam, TSP Headers, Gibson Catback exhaust. Tuned by Sam @ Advanced Modern Performance.

Suspension: 2/4 Belkin drop. Belkin Sway bars, Spohn Panhard bar

Audio: Pioneer 8400 NEX Head unit, Audio Dynamics DSP, 6th order enclosure with three 10 inch DC Audio Level 4s behind the third row. Wolfram 4500 on Subs, Wolfram AW 250.4 on the front stage Dual SkyHigh Car Audio 8 inch mid bass in the doors, quad 3.5 inch midrange drivers in the A-Pillars 

Dual Alternators, Mechman 320 powering a CES 40ah Lithium battery, OEM alt has an AGM on it.Viper remote start.

 

Wheels:  24 inch Luxx wheels/ 305/40 R24

Grammatically speaking, Prolly is not a word.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 351 Guests (See full list)

    • There are no registered users currently online



×
×
  • Create New...