Crossover Dilemma

[Qwiz]

12 hours ago, AaronT said:

SLA is source leval adjustment.

 

All these things will get signal dirty sooner in volume leval.

 

I think you might have pushed that amp too far with not knowing exactly what your settings were and something inside of it has given up or is on its way out.

 

in the past when I was younger I had and that I fucking just literally raped with bass boost and input level adjustments from locs.and when those amps finally gave up they still played but they didn't play right they fucking were like just moving the speakers and making a hollow sound I mean it was Bass the average human being would say hey that's a base system but it wasn't nothing what it was before the amp fucked up

You are not the only one trying to convince me that I somehow blew the amp. This is my third post here on SMD in the past year. After every post I thought I resolved the issue only to come back at me again. So

 

I have already change one bass amp which is still working fine only according to some it may be malfunctioning. I replaced that Mosconi One 240.2 with this overly expensive Jl Rd1000/1 amp. I had the switch on Low for the very first time and it sounded not clean since day one. There is no chance in wasting money on yet another amp this d be the 3rd one.

 

I am living in Germany and having a hard time with these audio shops here.  It s like bass to them is a very uninteresting car audio domain.

 

The only way I could resolve this is to go in my own country on holidays.

[Qwiz]

Update. I have been testing the whole equipment today I went to a car audio shop. SO here is the diagnostics:

 

Changed HU: same

Changed Amp: same

Changed Sub: same

Changed Subbox: same

Changed Crossover settings for the billionth time: same

 

Even the guy was stunned by these result, he couldn't believe his ears.

 

Have come to the conclusion it is this useless car acoustics' fault. I personally have noticed, when I attenuate the 50Hz Band, bass seems tighter. In this car the main problems with the bass is one you have this "uuuuuuuu" sound which is massively bothering and two there is somehow no pressure. I feel my pants and lower back vibrating but the pressure above this lower body I do not feel it.

 

The guy said he will get in contact with some other guy he knows. The amp and radio are fine in the end.

[AaronT]

Could it be maybe your expecting more from the subs than they could do?

 

What subs are they?

[Qwiz]

It's not about expectations, it just doesn't sound right, it's like a frequency on top of the original one it's hard to explain. You get this feeling when you listen from inside the car. There is nothing wrong with any component. Those 2 Subs I have are quite powerful and should generate good pressure and SQ, which are

 

JL w3v3-4 (500 @ 4 Ohm) and ESX Quantum qe1224 (800 @ Double 4 Ohm) 

 

I am telling you it is pure horror to listen in this car I don;t get how in the name of Christ was this built take a look at its form from the outside how the heck side is cut here the trunk is, it's staggering for one to question himself for so many years and still not knowing wtf is going on it is pure torture

[AaronT]

Those subs want a decent amount of space ported.

 

But a car isn't going to change sound that badly

 

The subs read fine on meters?

[CstrokerV]

Did you try a different amp? .... second those subs are not all that great to begin with so not sure what you expect out of them anything lower then a w6 from JL are mediocre at best... at least from my experience installing them and listening to them  listening to them....  also did you make sure both subs where in phase did you unhook the mids and highs amp and then played with the sub amp?

[CstrokerV]

On 5/16/2020 at 8:47 AM, AaronT said:

I honestly believe you got a overlooked setting somewhere.

 

Because the crossovers should work better the further apart thier filters are set. As you being then closer together, you get phase issues.

 

The way a crussiver works is it just gets certain signals out of phase 180° (at least my understanding) to filter them  

 

I may be incorrect in my understanding of the exact method used to filter, but I'm positive if I see your amp settings I could iron this out as long as both deck and amp aren't messed up in some way.

two different crossover point make a different crossover point it will be neither you set it at from what i read... but that was back in the day i think its in carstereo cookbook .... i do know if you have your deck and amp set at the same frequency you get a higher db slop 

[Qwiz]

I know I tried it all, I diagnosed everything except for the source, the battery. I didn't try changing the battery nor doing the big 3 because I don't experience voltage drops.

 

Look, in my other car I had a SPL Dynamics v300-s4 at 350W costs roughly 130$ in a prefab box it sounded awesome in that peugeot. The only big difference between this Kia and the 206 is that in Kia I have a whole inside when you open the trunk in the shape of the spare wheel, which I don't have, instead I have a some sort of flat tire kit, but the hole is there part of the vehicle, this is in Kia, as opposed to the Peugeot 206, which if you open its trunk and take the carpet off you didn't have this spare wheel hole, you would see bare metal, flat, the spare wheel is under the vehicle under the trunk on the outside. And the angle of the back window differs as well. Maybe this Kia is of poor acoustic materials composed. Doesn't the car's shape and building materials play a role too?

 

We have tested everything as said, except for the main power source. I was thinking maybe it does not have enough juice somehow. Very important thing, I remember in Peugeot no matter the hu or the amp settings, crossover settings it always sounded good. It sounded good since day one since I have got it installed. It was a pleasure just sitting there listening to whatever music it didnt matter every type of music sounded good and sounded cool, miss those days. Here in this other car so many issues. The trunk shape also differs.

 

Another important thing I discovered alone is when I played with the position of the subwoofer. I put it on the back seat firing towards the front. And it sounded a lot better but I have lost from little pressure that I had so I moved it back in the trunk. Then it began sounding muddier again. Then I played with the 16 Band Eq and NOTICED, once I TAMED the 50Hz Band to minus 4db that this cleaned the bass output. I am very suspicious that I have a MASSIVE around 50Hz cabin gain and my only solution according to this theory is the best eq settings, dsp maybe. At least it plays considerably better when this 50Hz band is attenuated.

[Qwiz]

One thing very important in car audio is if you are not lucky enough with your car and it is giving you a hard time, is that its acoustics play a huge role. How the bass is being manipulated after its exit through its port.

 

 I have played with the crossover settings yet again. Have set it at the 80Hz point on the amp, while on the PRS at 63Hz and very importanr the Slope 6dB/oct is the best scenario, Phase Reversed. The HPF for the front system is 80Hz -6dB. It sounds the best as of today with these settings. The Sub1 Setting is MONO. The 50Hz Band is at 0dB again because with these settings there seems to be no more bass overload due to cabin gain. I guess the waves cancel themselves somehow because at a higher bass frequency say 100hz you can barely hear it if the sub is ON because it cancels it coming from the front system. When the sub is off, the front system plays that freq at nirmal.volume. I somehow need to keep the Phase setting for the sub on REVERSE because it cleans the bass even more thourgh as at the price of some upper basd freqs.

 

[Joshdashef]

23 hours ago, Qwiz said:

I know I tried it all, I diagnosed everything except for the source, the battery. I didn't try changing the battery nor doing the big 3 because I don't experience voltage drops.

 

Look, in my other car I had a SPL Dynamics v300-s4 at 350W costs roughly 130$ in a prefab box it sounded awesome in that peugeot. The only big difference between this Kia and the 206 is that in Kia I have a whole inside when you open the trunk in the shape of the spare wheel, which I don't have, instead I have a some sort of flat tire kit, but the hole is there part of the vehicle, this is in Kia, as opposed to the Peugeot 206, which if you open its trunk and take the carpet off you didn't have this spare wheel hole, you would see bare metal, flat, the spare wheel is under the vehicle under the trunk on the outside. And the angle of the back window differs as well. Maybe this Kia is of poor acoustic materials composed. Doesn't the car's shape and building materials play a role too?

 

We have tested everything as said, except for the main power source. I was thinking maybe it does not have enough juice somehow. Very important thing, I remember in Peugeot no matter the hu or the amp settings, crossover settings it always sounded good. It sounded good since day one since I have got it installed. It was a pleasure just sitting there listening to whatever music it didnt matter every type of music sounded good and sounded cool, miss those days. Here in this other car so many issues. The trunk shape also differs.

 

Another important thing I discovered alone is when I played with the position of the subwoofer. I put it on the back seat firing towards the front. And it sounded a lot better but I have lost from little pressure that I had so I moved it back in the trunk. Then it began sounding muddier again. Then I played with the 16 Band Eq and NOTICED, once I TAMED the 50Hz Band to minus 4db that this cleaned the bass output. I am very suspicious that I have a MASSIVE around 50Hz cabin gain and my only solution according to this theory is the best eq settings, dsp maybe. At least it plays considerably better when this 50Hz band is attenuated.

Just read through this post. Might have missed stuff so forgive me if I do...

 

Do you mind sharing pics of your subwoofer box? Also disconnect the speaker wires from the box and use a multimeter to show the resistance (in ohms) of the subs. When you go to take a picture of the box leave it in the car to show where the port is and subwoofer in relation to the back hatch or seats.

 

I own and use the 80 PRS in an active network mode, different than standard, but never had an issue with the crossover network. It handles everything from my HPF on my tweeter channels to bandpassing my mids and LPF my subs, (two amps. 4 channel has a channel per speaker/tweeter). For shits and giggles, do you mind sharing your crossover settings on the 80 PRS? 
 

Really the more we can see the better. It is so hard to diagnose a problem without actually being in person so the more we can observe the better!  I really hope we can help you get back to cruising with some good tunes soon but we gotta find this problem first.