Yinlong cells or look elsewhere?

[1JCress]

sup guys, im new to the lithium world of things. starting my build, done some research & have a few build specific questions before I go ahead & spend some money lol. 

 

I currently have a 400amp mechman alt dedicated to running my car audio straight to the bank & about to purchase 2 banks (80ah) of xs Yinlongs. 2 x series 18v3's on a taramps 8k or 5k, (havent decided yet, leaning towards smart5) & then ill cater about 1500 or so for my voice speakers.. 

 

my gripe: I park with the vehicle on and play music continuously (most times full tilt) for long-ish periods of time. (understood that ill obviously have to give it a breather every now and then)  its a daily first & foremost & a park n play vehicle as well. is YinLong the right way to go? im used to all the AGM stuff in previous builds & dropping into the 11's/12's sometimes but I know thats not good for yinlongs. safety with the LTO in my daily was also a factor in deciding to go this route

 

any help would be appreciated, thanks

[SnowDrifter]

Looks good to me. LTO is a pretty good chemistry for car audio.


If you need higher density, Toshiba SCiB cells are a good alternative, though pricier and harder to get.

In either scenario, be mindful of where you purchase them from. There are a LOT of fakes and rebranded B / C stock floating around.

[1JCress]

42 minutes ago, SnowDrifter said:

Looks good to me. LTO is a pretty good chemistry for car audio.


If you need higher density, Toshiba SCiB cells are a good alternative, though pricier and harder to get.

In either scenario, be mindful of where you purchase them from. There are a LOT of fakes and rebranded B / C stock floating around.

Thanks for info brother. For certain I don’t mind spending the extra dollars with XS for peace of mind. In any case, is the higher density needed in my application for continuous parked play or will I be happy with the XS cells. I know I won’t have any issue while driving, just over thinking on the park n play scenarios. Prob gonna order my cells today  

[SnowDrifter]

22 hours ago, 1JCress said:

Thanks for info brother. For certain I don’t mind spending the extra dollars with XS for peace of mind. In any case, is the higher density needed in my application for continuous parked play or will I be happy with the XS cells. I know I won’t have any issue while driving, just over thinking on the park n play scenarios. Prob gonna order my cells today  

Density only helps you if you're out of space to fit more. If that's not a worry, then I wouldn't sweat it.

Reminders:

- Get a cell balancer - makes sure all the individual cells stay at an equal state of charge.
- Don't mix and match chemistries (or even sub chemistries). Delete your under hood battery. Granted LTO is way less sensitive to this. But still not ideal.
- Convert your alternator to external regulation or otherwise make sure it's constant voltage. No hot/cold charge voltage. LTO is less sensitive to this because of the sheer cycle count and durability. But you still don't want to overcharge when cold or lose out on capacity when hot.

Generally speaking, LTO is a wonderfully forgiving chemistry. Overcharging only reduces capacity(damages cells) - very low fire risk. Same with too much heat. So this stuff is less about safety and more about actually getting the capacity expected. 80ah of battery only holds at the appropriate state of charge. Charging low really sacrifices capacity. e.g. 6 cells in series. LTO is ~95% charged at 2.6v per cell, with full charge at 2.8v per cell. So if you're at 2.6v per cell, that's 15.6v for the whole battery. Nearly 100% charge - that's good. If, however, you're charging at 14.6v, that's 2.43v per cell, which is ~80% charge - not great, not terrible. 14v? Now you're down to about 60% charge on the pack. So that 80ah of capacity you paid for is only offering 48ah under these conditions.

I think XS power is even more conservative with these measurements on their units

 

[1JCress]

2 hours ago, SnowDrifter said:

Density only helps you if you're out of space to fit more. If that's not a worry, then I wouldn't sweat it.

Reminders:

- Get a cell balancer - makes sure all the individual cells stay at an equal state of charge.
- Don't mix and match chemistries (or even sub chemistries). Delete your under hood battery. Granted LTO is way less sensitive to this. But still not ideal.
- Convert your alternator to external regulation or otherwise make sure it's constant voltage. No hot/cold charge voltage. LTO is less sensitive to this because of the sheer cycle count and durability. But you still don't want to overcharge when cold or lose out on capacity when hot.

Generally speaking, LTO is a wonderfully forgiving chemistry. Overcharging only reduces capacity(damages cells) - very low fire risk. Same with too much heat. So this stuff is less about safety and more about actually getting the capacity expected. 80ah of battery only holds at the appropriate state of charge. Charging low really sacrifices capacity. e.g. 6 cells in series. LTO is ~95% charged at 2.6v per cell, with full charge at 2.8v per cell. So if you're at 2.6v per cell, that's 15.6v for the whole battery. Nearly 100% charge - that's good. If, however, you're charging at 14.6v, that's 2.43v per cell, which is ~80% charge - not great, not terrible. 14v? Now you're down to about 60% charge on the pack. So that 80ah of capacity you paid for is only offering 48ah under these conditions.

I think XS power is even more conservative with these measurements on their units

 

Amazing info brother. Few questions:

 

1) I’m ok with the way I’m running my setup? Stock alternator runs the truck & standard lead acid/agm battery while my Mechman runs specifically my bank? 2 1/0 positive cables from Mechman to bank in back and separated from everything else? 
 

2) which balancer do you recommend? I was going to purchase the heltech 6s.

 

3) when charging up before putting in vehicle, am I charging to where my alternator charges? Or a little under it? Say if my meh man is charging at 15.5. Do I charge it at 15.3-ish? 
 

Appreciate the info brother 

[SnowDrifter]

1 - Looks good there.

2 - Heltech one is just fine!

3 - Either/or. I wouldn't over think it. Even if you don't charge them, 80ah isn't exactly a great effort for a 400a alt to juice up. Assuming full load on the alt, and 0-100 SOC, that's what.... 12 minutes? Realistically less since they aren't shipped at 0% SOC and there's going to be resistance in the wires + pack. Wouldn't want to do that with a huge bank that's hundreds of amp-hours. But I wouldn't be stressing about this one.

[1JCress]

8 hours ago, SnowDrifter said:

1 - Looks good there.

2 - Heltech one is just fine!

3 - Either/or. I wouldn't over think it. Even if you don't charge them, 80ah isn't exactly a great effort for a 400a alt to juice up. Assuming full load on the alt, and 0-100 SOC, that's what.... 12 minutes? Realistically less since they aren't shipped at 0% SOC and there's going to be resistance in the wires + pack. Wouldn't want to do that with a huge bank that's hundreds of amp-hours. But I wouldn't be stressing about this one.

Perfect. Thank you again for the info

brother