Absolutely Insane

[BobbyG2]

I am just happy we still have the freedom to speak and have different opinions.

Speaking of which, have you heard of "free-speech-free" zones? They're mostly around the "government" buildings in Washington D.C. (I quotation government because they're just a cover for who really controls the policies)

This country is no longer a Representative Republic, it is a Fascist Police State. Neither Obama nor McCain would've been able to save this "country". This country died in the 1930's, when the government was handed over to the Federal Reserve. The last TRUE president was John F. Kennedy, and he tried to save our country from Fascism... We all know what happened after the people who put him in power found out that he wasn't on their side.

teresting point, but I don’t think sales tax alone would be able to pay for all of the government run programs that are out there, whether we know what they are or not. There would be alooot less cops out there (mmm…may be a good thing blum.gif) less fire men, roads would go to hell….

None of those are paid for by "income" taxes.

What about the people that hoard their money anyway? They don’t contribute to the tax system.

So? They earned their money, so they are entitled to do whatever the heck they want to do with it! and that includes nothing. So, if you were to earn a dollar, you'd think it'd be fair for the "government" to charge you for earning it?

As the great Joe Biden once said….its American to pay taxes. jk. I hate taxes as much as the next guy, but I feel that without them, we wouldn’t have some of the things we take for granted.

Duh?

Or how about the multi millionaire Wall street CEO who makes 12 mil a year, but doesn’t buy anything new because he has everything. Shouldn’t some of his money go back into the system?

He can choose where he spends his money. It's not the "government"s job to decide what he spends his money on.

Its all about cost of living, if you make lots you are live pretty comfortably, what’s wrong with some extra money out of your pocket?

Because it's HIS money.

When you make a lot, you don’t have to worry about bills being paid etc etc.

Which is why everyone should aim to be a multimillionaire.

[mr.p]

I dont listen to the radio (no antenna in the car), i dont read the newspaper, i dont watch television (at all). All of those are completely biased. You never see 2 sides to the story, and if you do its not even a legitimate report.

When i got my right to vote, and tried to have an active voice by voting, researching politics and what we vote on completely turned me away from it. I lost all interest. For now, im going to cash my check every week, and buy all the car audio i can. When the world truly goes to hell ill have a stockpile of subwoofers, batteries, and ammunition

[mxer111]

It's terribly long and problably somewhat bias but you can't seem to make it NOT make sense. Most of what they say makes perfect sense. If you got an hour or so check it out.....

Bitching about taxes isn't going to change anything, The only thing you can do to combat taxes is to buy a gun and sell crack .

And somebody mentioned gun laws????? I love how people thanks that helps. What I know and most people from certain "hoods" know is what a throw-away is.

$115 for a nine all day up here. Now Let's just say im a stick up man. I got my "throw-away". I run up on you, Wait a minute...... You can't defend yourself cause I have heat and you don't. Felons can't buy guns anyways so you think making it harder to buy a gun at On Target Ammo is gonna keep the bad guys from having them.. NOPE!!!!!!!!

PS... I would never suggest you really sell crack!!! http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/board/public/style_emoticons/default/dirol.gif And I don't advocate illegal guns sales or possesion!!!

[dsoccer]

I don’t think BobbyG2 understands the tax system. If we don’t pay taxes we don’t have any public things that we take for granted, healthcare, security, infrastructure, education…It is typical not to like them, no matter where you go you will pay them, no way around it. Here is a nice site for you to look at:

http://www.buzzflash.com/perspectives/taxes.html

Read up on those, then tell me if you still don’t want to pay taxes, if you don’t then stop flushing your toilet .

So elections in Novembers don’t mean anything then, if we aren’t a representative public? We cast our vote to who we want to represent us ie the example of a representative nation. Just because the people you want to represent you aren’t in office, doesn’t mean you aren’t represented.

Wow so your saying the assassination of JFK was justified? Because he didn’t appeal to all people? Wow, we are moving in the wrong direction. It doesn’t matter what any elected official does, someone won’t like it. Just disappointing. Please read my comment earlier about Fascism, I’m pretty sure I shot down the talk that this country is Fascist.

Mr.P….nicely said ….is it just me or I have stolen this thread and make it a back and forth between me and conservatives? 

Mxer111….I agree no gun laws would be able to take the guns out of the “hoods” (as you so elegantly put it ). But stricter gun laws would prevent people from buying a dozen guns, then if the house gets robbed, then those guns are on the street. So now there are 12 guns on the street instead of 1 or 2. Just a thought. Another argument is that, is there really a need for an assault rifle? I can understand hand guns, but assault rifles? What do you need to take down that needs to be automatically fired upon with multiple rounds? That I ideologically I simply do not agree with.

[Colin - STAPUFT]

Oh, I totally agree that a flat sales tax wouldn't work. I said that in my last post- and I think you are 100% correct dsoccer when you say that a sales tax couldn't cover what the government spends. That is why the government needs to quit spending money it doesn't have! I don't claim to know everything the government spends money on or what HAS to be there and what doesn't, but it would seem simple.... roads, police, highway patrol, firemen, teachers, etc.... but you have to agree that they waste 20x more than goes towards good. We do need to pay our fair share of taxes. That is why a sales tax or just any FLAT tax would be fine by me. But when you start this whole sliding scale of taxes, you reach a point of diminishing return for the worker, the worker works less and suddenly no one is working. This is still a free capitalist country, so if one person makes more money then good for them. They shouldn't be punished because someone else wasn't as hard working or lucky or whatnot.

Stop crying all you babies out there... life isn't fair. Rappers don't sell albums by crying on them saying how they wish they had good cars and money and how it isn't right that they aren't making money. They sell albums by hustling, working and flipping their $20 a million times. There is a word for those cry babies- PUNKS.

My 12 hours of OT was when minimum wage was $5.15 per hour. Trust me... I know what my check was.... like an extra 20-25$ or so. That hurt my feelings bad. After state and federal taxes, social security, and so on...

I have 2 people in my family who have government jobs right now. One has never been in the private sector. He makes well over 100k per year and has no concept of reality. He spends money like it is water. Both of my parents had STATE jobs and squeaked by. Why is that? Why is it that the states paid less? Because they had less, and they have to pay attention to what they spend. Where did the Federal government get its money? From the people and the states!!!! This is crazy! This country was founded on the principal that the "little man" was the powerful. The little man made the real choices in his own life. Now it is the other way around. My answer isn't to regulate and cap salaries (they already have with the levels and pay scale), but the government needs to do what US Households have to do. See what actually comes in (not what they estimate for the next tax year...) and spend much less than that. Don't spend MORE!!!

Obama has made the US debt 4x it's highest size under Bush in his first 100 days. He is still spending. And please don't say the "stimulus" helped because less than 7% of that money has been sent out as of yet. A reporter asked Obama in a press conference "When do we run out of money?" and his answer was "We already have run out of money" That is why it is debt! What happens when you run your home like the US government? It won't be long before you are out on your butt. The reason the US government is still here is because it prints it's own money and says it is good for it! Well- the Government's lenders have called their bluff as of late.

This is still the greatest country in the world. We have the smartest and most ingenious people here, in what is still the Freest country in the world. I don't dispute that. If it weren't so, I would fight against it and or leave. But I also know what this country started as and we are far from that. If we did so well so long to get this far- why would you fundamentally change something that has gotten you to such a level of success? That is suicide. I don't get that at all.

...yeah, these are fun. I can have political-esque discussions as long as it is point counter point stuff. All the screamin' hurts my head.

[dsoccer]

I’m sure in the broad scheme of things, some are wasteful. But what might be wasteful to you might not be wasteful to me and vice versa. That is why Obama cut some 120 programs (if I recall correctly) that he deemed wasteful. But there are programs, I’m sure, that occur everyday that we don’t even realize benefit us in some way. But there is a lot of money that is being spent in the budget, something like 1/3 of non-military spending is Medicare and Medicaid. Something I don’t take advantage of, but I know it is beneficial to our society. I guess in the end its all in the perspective of who is in charge.

I agree hard work and determination gets you where you want to go. I have never had hand-outs and I appreciate the money I do earn, because I put in the work to earn it. I’m not sure if I said something to incite the “cry baby” rant, but if I did I would like to know what it was.

Ahh makes a little more sense (about the OT).

I have no experience or frame of reference regarding Federal and State jobs, so unfortunately I can’t comment. But I do know that we are in more of a hole then when Bush was in office, simply because Obama has to clean up the mess he left him. Something that has to be understood is that stimulus bill won’t change anything overnight. I thought it was 20% sent out….but I’ll check up on that when I have some more free time. Anyway, there are a lot of loops to jump through to get the money, and there is something like 100 programs that have been deemed useless by some standards. But that is out of 2000 or so that have also been initiated. That 7% (or 20%, whatever it is) is a small step towards a larger goal that will be in full effect probably in the next year or two, we have to be patient .

We ran out of money as soon as we crossed into the negative, but since it is a government they have ways around it, like borrowing. I’m in the cash negative, but I borrow using credit cards to make ends meet. I’m in debt and overtime that debt will all be paid off, similar to what is happening now. Like the phrase goes, you have to spend money to make money; that phrase works perfectly for the Obama administration. The stimulus will help us in the long run, and some in the short term, we just have to wait until it all takes effect. I know the Fed has printed more money, but they haven’t printed a lot. They printed enough to where it wouldn’t effect inflation noticeably, they found a nice balance; but obviously they just can’t print money all day long.

The fundamental idea of the US is still in tact, and has been; capitalism. But overtime we learn mistakes and problems from that system, ie this recession. So what do we do? Fix the problem to the best of our ability and try and put programs in place so this won’t happen again. Our history has been plagued with booms and busts, who knows when we will get the formula right to when there is just steady growth.

I don’t know about the other people, but I feel like I’ve scared some people away from this forum. It looked like people regularly posted on here before, but I may be wrong about that though .

Damn, I thought I wasn't going to have too much to write about ha.

[sayhuh?]

you know whats wrong with politics in America?? People want what they want when they want it.

It's like holding out your hands and wanting in one and shitting in the other and seeing which one fills up faster.

Obama never stood a chance and still doesn't. He was doomed to fail before he took over because of the poltical nutjobs which are just as bad as those religous nutjobs (they may even be the same people). He was criticised on every step he took and bashed for everything he wanted to try and tried. Bush was at fault for all of this mayhem and Obama is getting the blunt blame for having to fix someone elses problems.

As for Obama's spending...especially with health care...If our health care system isn't fixed, the 1 trillion in spending he is trying to get for health care is not going to be shit compared to what medicare/medicaid will cost us tax payers in 10 years. Think we're bankrupt now? Just wait. Socialism isn't going to look so bad then.

As for the CEOs, it isn't about them making millions. Its about them raping the consumers to make millions and then when the company fails because of their greed they walk away with the millions they took from greed. Their business has to then be bailed out by those people (the tax payers) the just took millions from to keep their company running all to get another check to add to their millions already collected...seems fair? Or the business goes bankrupt and people are now unemployed, with no health care and the CEO and his whole family are good to go from the millions paid out to him for having a company fail. Win win. A cap just ensures money is left to the business for situatioons like those that have happened over the past two years. I think a CEO should make good money, but 30-40 million in bonuses while the company is BR or being bailed out all due to their own greed?? MM no.

BTW F all politicians, Repubs, Dems..whom ever. They are all crooks , liars, etc. If you back one more than the other, then you are just choosing the lessor of two evils. If you're a die hard repub or dem, Independant, your just ignorant. (IMO)

Pot stirred.