STREET PREACHER Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 excellent post !! " WELCOME TO AMERICA!!" we speak english here..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSoundz Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 You are falling into the "market hype" of NOT loud subs. Your old school stuff (in terms of making noise) was much louder. Especially to the human ear. Alot of the old school stuff was based on what was loud in the field of concerts. Car subs today are great for moving tons of air and no noise. They are very good at producing a wide range of hz just because it's in a controled field and can move the air, unlike a concert sub in a car. The concert sub in a car would have a very narrow band width of hz and would distort easier. Nothing wrong with moving air, but explaining this will lead me to effieciancy. The old school sub was very efficient and made noise and took less actual power to do so. The new subs move tons of air, not as efficient(loud), but play alot cleaner and more hz. This is why class D amps are so great now. I remember back when class D technology was coming into play for car audio back in the early 90's. The makers said it produced tons of power, but the down fall was distortion because of the modified sine, it was square, unlike a class A amp which is a true(wave, not square) sine. This is how the class D amp got it's name...."Class Distortion" A sub with high sensitivity on a class D amp will show how dirty the sound is! Even at no volume, the sub will move crazy like. Unlike the low sensitive subs (that move tons of air) on a class D amp the sound is clean. This is also why the subs that move tons of air need tons of power. Unlike the subs back when we were kids, that took less power to produce noise. In terms of noise output, which is louder? Debatable? And this could get nasty. All car subs today require to be in the car to be loud(or to create the air movement). I remember a time, when I would be in the house and all day long you could hear people with the loud car audio drive by.......now you don't. And I know a few big guys around town pumping the crap out of their stuff,.........you just don't hear it. Be easy guys..! LOL Excellent post, infomational and very well written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 The makers said it produced tons of power, but the down fall was distortion because of the modified sine, it was square, unlike a class A amp which is a true(wave, not square) sine. This is how the class D amp got it's name...."Class Distortion" A sub with high sensitivity on a class D amp will show how dirty the sound is! Even at no volume, the sub will move crazy like. I'm sorry, but... what? Wha....at? No, just no. A sub will only move like crazy with no volume if the output drive is fucked or the filter section is faulty. I've scoped large numbers of Class A, Class A/B and Class D amps and no, class D amps don't output random shit that will make some old high-sensitivity woofer jitter around like crazy. And as for modified sine, again, what the hell. No. Go stick a scope on the output of a Class D amp playing a 50hz sine wave and I DEFY you to show me the difference between that and the output of a Class A or Class A/B amp. That post in general...hrmmrmmrmrm. :01nocomment8so: :01nocomment8so: EDIT: Sorry to get my asshole hat on but IMO that's straight up misinformation :S 10.x volts fo' life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forevrbumpn Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 I would listen to Boon any day over that post I have a ritual called "terminator". I crouch in the shower in the "naked terminator" pose. With eyes closed I crouch for a minute and visualize either Arnie or the guy from the 2nd movie. I then start to hum the T2 theme. Slowly I rise to a standing position and open my eyes. It helps me get through my day. The only problem is if the shower curtain sticks to my terminator leg. It sorta ruins the fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1030tooled Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Class D amps have came along way, but still far from the cleanest! Go put a class D amp on some SQ highs! ...........Very bad practice. Go talk to the Sound Quality guys and ask them "why not class D on the mids"? Class D is awsome on the "NO LOUD, all it does is move air" subs. If the speaker had a high sensitivity(sensitivity being the key word) it would only produce what signal it is being fed. Yes class D is alot better than before, but still not the cleanest. We can argue this and get no where. Each to their own. But long story short, ......it will all fall to "TRADE OFFS"! Class A = clean Class D = dirty I'm not knocking class D, just letting the guy know where he stands with his old stuff. Don't expect much from the new subs with the old amps. The subs today are not like we had back in the day. 93' Ford Aerostar Alpine head unit 4-5.25 MB Quarts 20-10" pyramids super Pro 1 Lanzar amp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Class D amps have came along way, but still far from the cleanest! Go put a class D amp on some SQ highs! ...........Very bad practice. Go talk to the Sound Quality guys and ask them "why not class D on the mids"? Tell that to the Alpine PDX amps. I've run my tweets on a class D amp and they sounded fine. The reason people don't run class D on full range drivers is because a class D design that has a filter point higher than about 250hz is very complex and difficult to build. Nothing to do with SQ. Class D being dirty is a historical myth from the days when the output filters sucked. Todays Class D amps (be it full range or sub-amp only) are just as clean as any Class A/B. Yes Class A is perhaps a little cleaner due to no intermodulation distortion but when you're talking about a 3ft long amp that makes 50w at 35% efficiency then who cares, I would rather have my 1ft long Class D making 1000w+ and staying stone cold. EDIT: Besides. The invention of feedback loops has made this all redundant, a $50 amp of any class should be able to stay under 0.1% THD @ rated power. 10.x volts fo' life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corrie32 Posted October 19, 2009 Report Share Posted October 19, 2009 Class D amps have came along way, but still far from the cleanest! Go put a class D amp on some SQ highs! ...........Very bad practice. Go talk to the Sound Quality guys and ask them "why not class D on the mids"? Class D is awsome on the "NO LOUD, all it does is move air" subs. If the speaker had a high sensitivity(sensitivity being the key word) it would only produce what signal it is being fed. Yes class D is alot better than before, but still not the cleanest. We can argue this and get no where. Each to their own. But long story short, ......it will all fall to "TRADE OFFS"! Class A = clean Class D = dirty I'm not knocking class D, just letting the guy know where he stands with his old stuff. Don't expect much from the new subs with the old amps. The subs today are not like we had back in the day. [/quote you need to do some more homework, and listen to Boon. Pioneer "Ice power", Alpine, Eclipse all are full range class d, and Car audio mag did a review on each of them, and lets not forget about Zapco C2k class d amps, that also plays full range i love this sh--t man 1966 Ford Fairlane Pioneer prs 80, the big three, with 2 big azz agm batts, dual 270/200 amp alts , two 8'' mids and tweets in the kick( PPI phantom 600.2). two 10''s and tweets in the doors, two 10'' mids and tweets in the rear decK ( Lanar opti 500x2). 2 C2 Audio Threatcon 4 12s on a Crunch GP3000d. No crossover . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve01S Posted October 24, 2009 Report Share Posted October 24, 2009 I still have a fairly old RF (2000 model) power bd1000a1. The factory says my amp put out 1100+ watts and I see them on ebay once in awhile for around 300-400 bucks. This amp should have no problem pushing just about any subs rated for 1000 watts rms or less. See if you can find a few of those on ebay and then get a few subs to go along. I just recently got a PPI PRO 124 that is rated for 10000 WRMS still working on the box and new amp rack. I got it from sonicelectronix for 170. I believe these are similar models to the 1 s the Gates family used in their ford bronco. I have also seen some kicker L7 s on sonic for about 250 or so. So if your into buying off ebay get 4 of those amps for about 1,200 or so and then get 4 of the kicker L7's. that should put you really close to your 2500 budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eliassami5 Posted October 24, 2009 Report Share Posted October 24, 2009 I still have a fairly old RF (2000 model) power bd1000a1. The factory says my amp put out 1100+ watts and I see them on ebay once in awhile for around 300-400 bucks. This amp should have no problem pushing just about any subs rated for 1000 watts rms or less. See if you can find a few of those on ebay and then get a few subs to go along. I just recently got a PPI PRO 124 that is rated for 10000 WRMS still working on the box and new amp rack. I got it from sonicelectronix for 170. I believe these are similar models to the 1 s the Gates family used in their ford bronco. I have also seen some kicker L7 s on sonic for about 250 or so. So if your into buying off ebay get 4 of those amps for about 1,200 or so and then get 4 of the kicker L7's. that should put you really close to your 2500 budget. lol ur post just killed the whole class A/D argument... 91' Jeep Cherokee - The Heep Just Empty Every Pocket 96' Volvo 960 - The B◘x [sPL_4_U] HiFonics - Alpine Pioneer - Clarion Infinity - Kicker KnuKonceptz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cashdollar2009 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I was running two 15" Petra Prowlers in a sealed box a month ago. They were manufactured in 1994. I powered them with with a cheapo visonik amp feeding them about 200 watts rms a piece. Did a 141.4dB term-lab at the dash. 1997 Chevrolet Cavalier Two 12" DC Audio XL M2'sCrescendo Audio BC5500d Current Scores: 150+ out the Trunk On 6/30/2011 at 1:11 AM, 'Ray' said: Acoustical energy is free. Electrical energy is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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