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Super Pivot or Reg Rubber  

3 members have voted

  1. 1. Which type would work best for handling?

    • Super Pivot
      2
    • Rubber Bushing
      1
  2. 2. Which type of link set up?

    • Two link w/ panhard
      0
    • Parallel four link w/ panhard and bags on rear 6th links
      3


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K. I'm tired of being ghetto and not having good ride quality and handling.

I have mono leaf rear with bags below and behind the axle. Works fine but hops on burnouts and doesn't ride the way I think it should.

I was thinking two link w/ bags on bars but heard that they have almost no roll center due to the fact that they are rigidly mounted to axle. But would super pivot ends help any?

And I've been wanting this:

KPComponentsFullsize6-LinkCantileverKit.jpg

and can build it for less than 1/2 what it sells for. But it looks like it has rubber bushings. When I build it would it make a big difference if i used rubber bushings or the super pivots. I'm not going to three wheel. or hit side to side hard. I just want good handling with as little suspension fighting back as possible as cheaply as I can do it.

Rubber bushing: This is $60

Square4-LinkBungwithPolyBushings.jpg

Super pivot: This is $120

Square4-LinkBungwithSuperPivot.jpg

Edit: Oh and I'm not going to cut up the bed except for the tubs and axle tunnel. The Tank/compressor/and valves are going on either side of the speaker box. Gas tank is staying put just raised or sectioned to clear frame. and behind the axle/panhard is going to be a Meade style battery compartment. the rest of the bed is going to be clean and amped up.

Edited by JMZNeal

JVC AVX-44 and 360.2

Subs: 2 RF T1 12s 1ohm mono off a RF T1500bdcp 80hz \/ in a 2.3cube 45hz slot port

Mids: 2 O2 8's off a Punch 550.2 behind seat, 2 Image Cxs 6.5's and 2 ID XS 6x9s 80-3khz in doors on a T600.2

Highs: 2 ID CD.1 MH HLCD 8ohm off a RF 400.4 3khz /\

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that 6-link is fine , go with the poly bushing rod ends . they will last longer and if you do wear them out , they are easily replaced . just stay away from hiem joints , they make a bunch of noise and wear out quick !!!

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taking another look at it , i noticed it has a pan hard bar , not good !! if you run big wheels and have minimal tire clearence to the insides of your quarter panels or fenders , the panhard bar can and will rub cause the cycling of the rear suspension with a panhard bar will make the rear end move side to side . your best route with a six link would be to incorporate a wish bone . take a look at how KP components does there s10 kit , that is what you want to do for your full size truck .........

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I got room. It'll only be .25" l/r travel with 10-12 inches of lift. My 18's have that on either side as is. I figured the polys were fine. I'm doing a Ranger so the links will be shorter than the kit and building it myself will only cost me 700 vs 1700 with the KP components kit in the pic. I don't want to do a 3link wishbone cuz i don't want to have to cut up the bed or move the gas tank or anything like that. Call me lazy i guess.

Any tips on running the 4link to give me good handling/tire loading/roll center any of that.

I have the understanding that it has to do with the angle of the bars(not exactly parallel) and length (one longer one shorter) and position of pan bar. I'm thinking drag car set up i guess cause that's what i've been around all my life but I want cornering capability too?

Edit: And i would never use hiems...well the suicide doors pan hard has one on one end but i can live with that.

I've been doing some research.

At what angle should I place the 4 link bars? The

panhard bar? How critical are the angles?

We typically try to place the lower bars level at ride height. This will

minimize "roll steer" (slight wheelbase change caused by the arc of the

bars going through their travel). The upper bars should also be level,

or slightly down at the front if need be. This configuration will provide

stable handling and braking characteristics. It is important to get the

bars exactly the same from side to side to avoid unpredictable

handling problems. It is also extremely important to make sure the

panhard bar is level at your highway ride height. This will minimize side

travel of the rear axle induced by the arc of the panhard bar going

through its travel. Obviously there are precise formulas for placement

of the 4 link bars to maximize certain performance criteria, but these

performance differences are quite small on a road car. Put the bars in

level, or close to it, at ride height, and you'll be fine.

And minitruckin has given me hope that it's not as hard as i thought as long as i do some math and measurements before I weld a universal link kit on. The canti rear bars and the dog bone lengths are my last concern but i think after i make a scale drawing and AutoCadd it I will be fine.

Edited by JMZNeal

JVC AVX-44 and 360.2

Subs: 2 RF T1 12s 1ohm mono off a RF T1500bdcp 80hz \/ in a 2.3cube 45hz slot port

Mids: 2 O2 8's off a Punch 550.2 behind seat, 2 Image Cxs 6.5's and 2 ID XS 6x9s 80-3khz in doors on a T600.2

Highs: 2 ID CD.1 MH HLCD 8ohm off a RF 400.4 3khz /\

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  • 2 weeks later...

as far as the length of the 4-link bars , keep them as close to the same length as you can !!!! if you say you have only a 1/4" space between your tire/wheel to your quarter panel , i really don't think you should go with the panhard bar , but that is your choice . if it was me , i would not even consider it .......

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why wouldn't i make the top one shorter slightly. it's for roll steer right? so one side doesn't go forward and one back when cornering. ??? idk. but that makes my job easier. :pardon:

Angle them to "meet/cross" at the front bumper and level the bottom link at ride height. That's what i've got so far... the dog bone is really just going to end up being like a rear hanger (two pieces of flat metal) and one bushing off the axle and one off the bag lift bar...so figuring the lenght will be as easy as drilling holes and moving it.. don't work try again. get it right build a pretty set...

Pan hard is going to be so wide i won't even have .3inch l/r travel so once i get it set so it's as far as i want it to one side all down and in the middle at ride height it won't rub... my other option is a watts link and i don't want to spend that much more money. No triangles no wishbones. behind axle is only for batts.. gas tank stays put.. i mean raised... and muffler ocupies other side of axle.

Thank you for your input... this really is a dead area in the SMD world. Not much to talkabout in this area huh???

JVC AVX-44 and 360.2

Subs: 2 RF T1 12s 1ohm mono off a RF T1500bdcp 80hz \/ in a 2.3cube 45hz slot port

Mids: 2 O2 8's off a Punch 550.2 behind seat, 2 Image Cxs 6.5's and 2 ID XS 6x9s 80-3khz in doors on a T600.2

Highs: 2 ID CD.1 MH HLCD 8ohm off a RF 400.4 3khz /\

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why wouldn't i make the top one shorter slightly. it's for roll steer right? so one side doesn't go forward and one back when cornering. ??? idk. but that makes my job easier. :pardon:

Angle them to "meet/cross" at the front bumper and level the bottom link at ride height. That's what i've got so far... the dog bone is really just going to end up being like a rear hanger (two pieces of flat metal) and one bushing off the axle and one off the bag lift bar...so figuring the lenght will be as easy as drilling holes and moving it.. don't work try again. get it right build a pretty set...

Pan hard is going to be so wide i won't even have .3inch l/r travel so once i get it set so it's as far as i want it to one side all down and in the middle at ride height it won't rub... my other option is a watts link and i don't want to spend that much more money. No triangles no wishbones. behind axle is only for batts.. gas tank stays put.. i mean raised... and muffler ocupies other side of axle.

Thank you for your input... this really is a dead area in the SMD world. Not much to talkabout in this area huh???

for the "roll steer" you are talking about , the triangluted bars or panhard bar takes care of that . the reason for the same size bars ( take a triangulated 4-link for example , the lower bars and the triangulated bars need to be the same length ) is to keep proper the proper pinion angle thru the axis(travel) of the 4-link .

as far as the muffler/exhaust , you should have the end of the exhaust (muffler tip) end about a foot before the axle . for the end of the tip , use a turn down (aimed either at the ground or at least away from gas lines , airline and bags or any thing else that will be affected by the heat )

and about the panhard bar , what do you mean by it being "wide" ???

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which ever side the panhard bar is connected to the frame , when the vehicle is raised up , the axle will move the same way . the more lift , the more side to side travel . panhard bars are very popular on hotrods cause they have short ranges of travel . when you are looking at up to 10-15" of travel on most truck air suspensions , the panhard bar is just not a viable option .

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i under stand what your saying about the pan hard bar. and wide means as long as possible (larger dia. arch) with the mounts wide..far side of axle and as close to frame as possible. not mounted half way down axle and inside of frame. i have little more offset 18's on it now.. more clearance. :yahoo:

Not really worried about extreme lift thought. just smooth ride and good handling. purpose of the rear bar is for compounding weight. lift may not be but 7-9 inches but smooth as a caddy. hopefully.

edit: if i air way up i'll kick out to one side but not rolling fast. so it doesn't mean much to me.

Edited by JMZNeal

JVC AVX-44 and 360.2

Subs: 2 RF T1 12s 1ohm mono off a RF T1500bdcp 80hz \/ in a 2.3cube 45hz slot port

Mids: 2 O2 8's off a Punch 550.2 behind seat, 2 Image Cxs 6.5's and 2 ID XS 6x9s 80-3khz in doors on a T600.2

Highs: 2 ID CD.1 MH HLCD 8ohm off a RF 400.4 3khz /\

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