Cashdollar2009
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Posts posted by Cashdollar2009
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They ask for 1.0ft^3 a piece. So here's a box for both of them for $45.00. Good temp to hold you over. At least built to the sealed recommendations.
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What frequency? Nice scores.
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Here's a question for A Team. I know who you are. I trust you. How would the difference be made when used in a ported enclosure application?
I understand your statement as if you were to test it in an infinite baffle application, the front of the cone has no motor/basket/etc obstruction as the rear wave would see. But in a ported enclosure, are you not STILL implemented both the front AND rear wave? Whereas in either situation, the front and rear wave would both be used to achieve output?
If you say it is true, then I trust your words a lot more than my quick brainstorming session. But using a common sense approach to this topic, this is what still has me curious?
I had actually made mention of this in my post from last night that i closed accidentally.
Yes that is the purpose of a port to convert rear waves 180 degrees into usable front wave. This is obviously more efficient. Now look at how the output goes from rear to front wave forms. There is always cancellation occurring inside confined spaces. also look at the output areas, subs cone area vs port area. Again look at restrictions and the path a rear wave whether it comes off the front of the sub or the back of the sub (if inverted) has to go through to become a output. Again you will find you get the majority of your output from the subs wave outside the enclosure. You will however have greater SPL inside the enclosure because its pressurizing a smaller loaded area, but that means if the SPL is trapped inside the box it is not getting outside, and you are not inside the box. So to run over this again you get the most output from outside the enclosure (sub normal or inverted) and less from the port or rear wave output. So now outside of the enclosure put the test i stated to go use and think about this. Do you want your more efficient outputting wave trapped inside the enclosure or do you want it outside where it is combined with the more efficient output of the enclosure? Thats right why not pair up the two best outputs for more gain? Variables or not you want to optimize every aspect of the system, so why bottle neck here?
I have nothing against inverted, but this is all stuff i know from years...... and years of playing with this stuff. And like i said most of this here is basic look at it and see the differences.
Here is a good visual... Look at this pic, you put this motor in front of your main output and you can see how it would affect it in a HUGE way. If you have your glasses on and look real hard you can see there is something in the way on the back end of this sub, and all subs.
Makes perfect sense to me. I appreciate you taking the time to clarify those things for me.
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Here's a question for A Team. I know who you are. I trust you. How would the difference be made when used in a ported enclosure application?
I understand your statement as if you were to test it in an infinite baffle application, the front of the cone has no motor/basket/etc obstruction as the rear wave would see. But in a ported enclosure, are you not STILL implemented both the front AND rear wave? Whereas in either situation, the front and rear wave would both be used to achieve output?
If you say it is true, then I trust your words a lot more than my quick brainstorming session. But using a common sense approach to this topic, this is what still has me curious?
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Why not save the money on the second 12" and just get the 15" reconed to a second 12" instead? That is assuming that you do not go through the interchangeable baffle idea. It just doesn't sound very practical. You'd be better off just doing interchangable ports to find the sound that you want..... Motors get expensive after a while.
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Only face everything forward if you can seal all of the sound pressure into the cabin. If you aren't looking to play with expanding foam or lots of tape and time, face your sub and port back.
I have yet to hear a setup facing forward NOT sealed off to be louder and cleaner than that of one bing sealed or facing the rear. The subwoofer is supposed to "load" off of the inside of the trunk lid.
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I have ran my 15" XL in 3ft^3 for a year now with no issues. At 3.25ft^3 I was seeing some unloading issues around 30Hz. At 3ft^3 I seem to be reaching xmax but with no unloading issues. My XL has taken my Crescendo great in this power. When I run number on the Torres calculator, I am coming up with 6.15ft^3 after bracing displacement. This would be with the subs inverted to add to box volume. I would also be able to mount the subs normal to gain some extra port area and test how it does on the meter compared to inverted. With each sub in 3ft^3 a piece, I thought they would be just fine?
And 6th order... Is that the design Sanitarium implemented in his blow-through?
As far as the space goes for the 15s, I'm saying that you won't have enough room to be able to give them enough port area to make them happy and tune that low. I owned a 2000 Grand Am and I know there just isn't quite enough room.
As far as you experiencing unloading issues, was that when you played under your tuning or not? Just interested cuz I'm working on my 2 XL 15 box and can't decide how much box volume to give them, I'm stuck between 6 and 6.5 cubes.
And, Yes, Sanitarium has a 6th order and so does Lunchbox.inc, and I'm sure they could give you some tips on how to set one up properly. They are just a little tricky to work with.
Port area would honestly be my biggest issue right now. But I am planning on building in the trunk so I would be squeezing every bit of volume I could.
And as far as unloading goes, I was at 3.25ft^3 tuned to 32Hz with 18in^2 per ft^2. I was starting to unload at 30Hz. Then again, I was running around 3k off of my Crescendo before any impedance rise. When I rebuilt, I went to 3ft^3 tuned to 32Hz with 17in^2 of port area. I could play down to about 28Hz before I really had to worry about unloading at full tilt. The XL's can take a lot of power as long as it's clean. If they see any clipping on 2X their rms rating, you'll be frying tinsels in no time. The biggest issue that I have seen personally was when I first got my sub a year ago. Once those coils see clipping they heat up and burn through the thread stitching them to the spider. After that, they just slap the **** out of the cone until they finally snap, clean power or not at that point. Since then i've reconed and lost quite a bit of my ignorance. If I were you, if you are planning on running more than 3-3.5k to them (pair not individually), I'd stick with 6ft^3. This will give you great cone control lower in the frequency band so that unloading shouldn't be an issue as long as you don't have stupid-dumb big port area. lol
And I appreciate the idea on the 6th order. I'll do me some research as far as that goes.
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Lol then you are NO help to me Jeff.
40Hz IS good for most mainstream rap though. lol
Dustins has no clue. Im tuned to around 37hz, in my truck. And it still plays down to around 28-30. I choose to use a sub sonic filter to protect my subs from the large amount of power seen from playing below box tuning. Something Dustin does not have. Regardless a properly tunes ported box or bandpass will be fine. Just depends on your space and what you listen to and trying to do. Most bandpass boxes I see in the FL area all seem to tune around 45hz range. Which seems to be designed to play low and most of the chopped crap people call music. But fall flat on there face above 50hz. The ridgeline bandpass is tuned to 54hz. Which is a nice middle point for what I want and plays well from 30-60hz
I suppose I can understand the trade-off between playing low, and playing the mid to high range of frequencies. I enjoy touching 30Hz and still being able to get that bit of a punch in the double bass of my rock music. I listen to 90% hip-hop/rap and enjoy songs that may dip to 30hz, and would also like to nail those lows. It's starting to look like a compromise i'm gonna have to make.
And I figured he was just poking fun at you. lol I appreciate the helpful insight sir.
I'll tell you one thing, you definitely don't have enough room for a proper ported box for 2 15" XLs, at least not tuned that low. I think the idea of a 4th order bandpass would be cool, but what about a 6th order? You'd be able to get a nice flat response from it and get down low like you want.
I have ran my 15" XL in 3ft^3 for a year now with no issues. At 3.25ft^3 I was seeing some unloading issues around 30Hz. At 3ft^3 I seem to be reaching xmax but with no unloading issues. My XL has taken my Crescendo great in this power. When I run number on the Torres calculator, I am coming up with 6.15ft^3 after bracing displacement. This would be with the subs inverted to add to box volume. I would also be able to mount the subs normal to gain some extra port area and test how it does on the meter compared to inverted. With each sub in 3ft^3 a piece, I thought they would be just fine?
And 6th order... Is that the design Sanitarium implemented in his blow-through?
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Lol then you are NO help to me Jeff.
40Hz IS good for most mainstream rap though. lol
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Heres a look at a BP for something along the lines that your asking about. http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/board/topic/98814-dc-honda-ridgeline-transformation-updated-310-making-noise/ Not using the 5k yet only the 3.5k. But I can tell u it will take more then the 3.5k
I followed your Ridgeline thread until it was put on hold. You definitely have a lot of skill. When I brought up bandpass, N8 threw you and Dustin's name out there.
What kind of output were you seeing from the single 3.5k? I saw that you said in there that it sounded good. I have yet to have the opportunity to hear a properly built bandpass design with quality subs. From experience, do you think i'd see more output from a good bandpass design than a typical ported box tuned between 28Hz-34Hz?
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How did you wire the two batteries? Just as Skittles asked...
+ to + and - to -
or...
+ to - and + to -
The first combination is called "parallel" and should yield a 12V reading. The second combination is called "series" and would yield a 24V reading. If you were to run your vehicle at 24V, a lot of your factory electrical components would fry.
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Hmmm... Yeah. What do you guys think of two 12" XL's in a 4th order? On my DC 5k do you think I may be able to get more low-end output from this option than two 12" XL's or 15" XL's in regular ported boxes?
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And I will say right now that a wall is out of the question.
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You won't have room for a bandpass with 4 12's in there unless you wall....
I was figuring...
That probably where your box was peaking at.
That was my peak frequency on the meter. I am still unsure of the cabin resonance off the top of my head.
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Where does your car peak? If its high (40+Hz), bandpass would probably be the better option for you.
I have honestly yet to figure that out. My first time metering I was tuned at 34Hz and peaked at 41Hz.
Second time I was tuned to 32Hz with an aero and peaked at 36-37Hz.
BeAlsTar I think is how it's spelled? Has a Grand Am which is the brother/sister car of my Alero and I believe he was peaking around 42Hz tuned at 36Hz?
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Well i've been entertaining ideas and throwing some thoughts around until I can get my money right. Basically I have narrowed my options down to a few. Here are the two that I am on now:
Two 12" or 15" DC XL's in a ported box tuned to 32Hz on a DC 5k.
or
Four 12" or 10" DC Level 3's in a 4th order bandpass on a DC 5k.
I already have the amplifier and have just sold my 15" XL locally. I put 12" or 15" and 12" or 10" depending on what I can fit with the room that I have. The original plan was a pair of 12" XL's, but in order to get the proper enclosure I would be VERY VERY close to building in my trunk, so if i'd build in the trunk I might as well go with 15"s, depending on if I can find a place for my batteries or not. Both setups would be sealed off into the cabin and I am working with a little over 6 ft^3 if I build in the trunk. I am hoping to have enough power to possibly compensate for any lack of space.
My goals are basically the generic sql answer you see. I seriously want to nail 28-30Hz, but still be able to see a high 140's on the meter.
Thanks for your thoughts and opinions guys. I have yet to play with bandpass enclosures so I would be seeking help for a design from one of the experts on here, so just answer assuming that the box will be designed properly.
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That's 2k of unclipped signal. Running 2,000wrms daily requires some electrical upgrading to keep your voltage around a steady 14-14.4. Dropping below this may result in some clipping. It'll take 2k, but if it is a clipped musical signal, it won't be taking that 2k for too long.
You have to be very careful when running more than the subwoofers rated rms value. You can gain quite a bit of performance if you know what you are doing in running more power, but also very risky if you don't. The manufacturer can typically tell why your subwoofer blew. If it was indeed from sending the driver a dirty signal or too much power, they will not cover that under warranty. Just an fyi.
So just by you asking this question leads me to believe that you should make sure you do a little more reading up before you plan to just throw that kind of power on that sub.
Best of luck to ya.
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I agree with most saying it will increase your tuning frequency which won't be great if you don't change amplifier settings. Also what did RAM calculate tuning for this box? I don't think you can get any better unless you do a whole "new" box... Modifying that current one would be a mistake... Removable port sounds cool and all but for a daily driver I think as is should be fine.. Maybe have him make up a new enclosure for higher power handling?
If you had an experienced designer put it together, i'd stick with it til you upgrade. Chances are, he knows what he's doing with those subs and power.
But you never know until you try some testing. Removable ports are inexpensive too as you just use leftover material as opposed to rebuilding a box over and over again.
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Make a removable port that bolts in with t-nuts and try a few different combinations. Play with tuning (shorter/longer port) as well as port area. (bigger smaller port)
My $0.02.
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If you get two just make sure you get dual 4-ohms so you can wire in parallel down to 1-ohm on your amplifier.
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Listen to TeamHT here honestly.
Level 4XL - AQ2200
Level 4 - AQ1200
Personally, i'd go with the Level 4XL because you have more room to add power down the road. On the AQ2200 i'd also aim for 4ft^3 with some good port. Reason being, I don't see you having much luck running 2,000wrms in 5ft^3 without unloading issues. I ran my 15" XL in 3ft^3 on my Crescendo 3kwp at .7-ohms nominal. Never clamped to see where my rise had me at, but on a 32Hz tuning I was starting to unload below 30Hz on this power even in 3ft^3. Port/Sub placement, box design, electrical have a lot to do with how efficient you'll be in the end. But with the XL again, you'd have room to grow down the road power-wise.
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5 Minute Edit. Let me know how it sounds!
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Working on it.
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fixed and edited for you
Someone is gonna win a XS power Intellicharger, directly out of my pocket (not the charger, the money lol).the ONLY thing i ask of course is that it goes to someone that can use it!! I hate seeing good equipment go to waste.... whoever gets it, enjoy
Details.
i think i just gave you the details
Oh....... My bad. Florida isn't gonna happen for a few years. Young gun in school.
Good thing you're doing though sir.
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Someone is gonna win a XS power Intellicharger, directly out of my pocket (not the charger, the money lol).
hahahha this video
in Off Topic - Random, Misc posts - the forum "Junk Drawer"
Posted
I... feel like I need to take a shower or something now. And go do something manly.