SINTORMAN
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Posts posted by SINTORMAN
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You won't find one N8. If you search his history on CACO or character in general he's the epitome of read, hear, and repeat but no first hand knowledge or experience. Not to mention an incredible disdain for SMD, the forum and person, and Damore. I don't say this to stir the pot, I say it because once you realize the true nature you can remove the facade of objectivity. He even made a thread asking why people used getting loud as a rebuttal in debates and why doesn't someone who doesn't compete or get loud get taken seriously.
I'm honestly surprised he's here at all.
I can see the point being made and know Cody will step up yo the plate. I know people who test things in their own like myself or Taylor can sympathize how much effort goes into helping and people can seem ungrateful. I love the AMM 1 as I didn't have to pay more money since I no longer work in a custom shop.
Just found something that I thought everybody would be interested in.
Yesterday while Ben (SINTORMAN) was in this thread trolling, check out what he wrote on a Colorado Car Audio Facebook Group:
This is a thread about clamping power at a competition....
Interesting that on an SMD forum he's going through every effort to push a complicated clamping solution that involves everything except an SMD product.
On the same night, on a FB group, he appears to be OK with suggesting the AMM1.
You'll notice earlier I said: I have nothing wrong with the amm1. Just a problem with people misusing equpiment.
Then someone said that a amm1 is cheaper than a proper clamping setup. I corrected them.
And I recommended the amm1 because I can trust myself watching the meters to record the right numbers but I'm not going to trust someone else running the meters. Hence why I also recommended the vital power device.
I'm glad TeamHT fits in good over here. I was hoping he would fit in somewhere lol.
EDIT:.. yeah I'm on that page to troll.. moron.
I also rescinded my comment about the amm1. Since I believe it will stop measuring when clipping sets in. So obviously no good for comps.
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Especially when idiots don't know what they're talking about and Google can't help them look smart, lol. Especially when they can't break a 45, lol
I'm going to assume this is aimed at me. And that is very wrong. My first real setup even broke a 45 rofl. If you are going to make accusations you might want to be able to back them up.
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so I can buy all those tools and a concrete bucket or 1 single tool?
geez, tough choice. but I do see that guys point, this isn't the only tool that works. But, I will let him use the concrete bucket...
I understand what he is saying as well, just giving him a hard time. Jokes aside, even if that setup worked, you would then know how many VA your amplifier can put out into a bucket of concrete. Still wouldn't tell you how many Watts your amplifier puts into your SPEAKERS
say what? That's exactly what your dyno does. Uses a purely resistive load to measure power output in watts....
Last time I checked a coil of wire is an Inductor, not a resistor. I think you are confusing it with this http://www.rexresearch.com/davis/davis.htm
Oh snap Tony doesn't know what bifilar winding is. rofl. it's as close as you can get to a completely resistive load with magnet wire.
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you're confusing the AMM-1 with the AD-1.. since this thread is about the AMM-1 im assuming Tony was talking about the new tool and not the amp dyno
yes but that in itself says the amp dyno doesn't matter since it's not connected to a real load rofl. And I doubt he would want people to think his dyno results are meaningless.
he was comparing the amm-1 vs your concrete bucket.. the ad-1 has no part in this thread
funny how it's in the title of this thread.
But if he wants to say that non resistive load scores are worthless than this dyno is pointless. Sorry but you can't have the cake and eat it too.
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You again. I thought I blocked you. rofl. If you can't see why this test is flawed you are a moron.
This is SMD, not CACO.
And no. The only thing you do continually is prove the only moron here is you. You stated the equipment was misused, which you failed to answer.
Now you're saying the test was flawed. There are a couple points you can take from this test and depending how you look this test is NOT flawed. Surprisingly since your tune is changed, not so anti SMD right now...makes sense with the bandwagon mentality from someone who couldn't get loud if his life depended on it.
Reading what someone else says is NOT intelligence. Care to provide some insight into the actual clamp method? Care to repeat your senseless ramblings? Care to provide your own factual information? God you're a fool
I know you are pretty retarded but maybe I'm giving you too much credit. The scope is approaching a full clip on the screen. Anyone clamping with a scope wouldn't allow that to happen unless they were as smart as you probably.
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you're confusing the AMM-1 with the AD-1.. since this thread is about the AMM-1 im assuming Tony was talking about the new tool and not the amp dyno
yes but that in itself says the amp dyno doesn't matter since it's not connected to a real load rofl. And I doubt he would want people to think his dyno results are meaningless.
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so I can buy all those tools and a concrete bucket or 1 single tool?
geez, tough choice. but I do see that guys point, this isn't the only tool that works. But, I will let him use the concrete bucket...
I understand what he is saying as well, just giving him a hard time. Jokes aside, even if that setup worked, you would then know how many VA your amplifier can put out into a bucket of concrete. Still wouldn't tell you how many Watts your amplifier puts into your SPEAKERS
say what? That's exactly what your dyno does. Uses a purely resistive load to measure power output in watts....
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I like the way you think sintorman, I just think the way you express yourself might get you banned here. I totally agree with mrd6 though. There was a flaw in this test that was easy to overlook, but now that its been brought to the attention of everybody I don't see why you can't just redo the test. Its not that the amm-1 or amp dyno is worse because of a redo. If anything it will prove they work consistently. But I would just be weary seeing a salesman keep up an advertisement that he knows is false and slandering his competition.
I only have an account on here to look at the classifieds occasionally. Really don't care if I'm banned. Caco is my home.
I'm not against the amm1.. Seems like a neat tool.
However I am against people making videos misusing equipment and praising the equipment that was used properly. It's just low.
No the truth is you're against anything with the SMD name. You have stated and proved this MANY times over, I do find it funny you're here though. How was any equipment misused? Or do you need your electrical engineering friends to fight the argument for you as well?
You again. I thought I blocked you. rofl. If you can't see why this test is flawed you are a moron.
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See now this to me is where it gets interesting. Now since you are posting a cheaper alternative people have choices. From the clamp tests I've seen people do it's a dmm and clamp, this is my first time seeing a scope or true rms meter for such a low price. Still comes into factor of how well the user can see clipping on the scope.Velleman HPS140I 99$
Craftsmen clamp meter 72$
Fluke 113 true rms meter 116$
Sorry just under 300$ and you can clamp your amps power for efficiency as well as many other tasks you can do with these three items vs the AMM1.
It would be nice to see a comparison of equipment like what sintorman posted and the amm1.
Take a look at that scope and tell me you think it will be accurate.
http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/velleman_hps140.html
Everything has its place and if they are used right the results will be true, but if you use cheap equipment or use it in the wrong way you will get inaccurate results.
It's only cheap because it uses 1 channel and can't measure high frequencies.. something that doesn't apply in the car audio industry. It's a damn good scope for the money.
not going to take sides cause i don't really give a shit. I am enjoying the debate and seeing all the experts and "experts" chiming in. Please continue.
No matter what tool you come up with Tony, there's always haters that smater than u
You should be listening to what I'm saying.. I could save you a lot of money. But nah you should just listen to the mfg for the dyno and amm1.. he's not biased at all. ROFL.
Tony props to you. Laughing all the way to the bank.
Look here im a grown ass man, i don't have to listen to you. who the hell are you. How many tools have you brought to the market. You also don't have to worry about saving me any money. I worked for my money and i will spend it the way i see fit.. Plain and simple get a name for your self first, then maybe we would start listening to you. I would listen to an engineer before i listen to a nobody.
Just because you don't know who I am doesn't mean you can't use common sense. Typical CA guy here. Oh man if he's not hitting a 160 then he's just an idiot. You are what's wrong with the industry. You rely on people to get your answers without using your damn head and actually learning why things happen the way they do etc..
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not going to take sides cause i don't really give a shit. I am enjoying the debate and seeing all the experts and "experts" chiming in. Please continue.
No matter what tool you come up with Tony, there's always haters that smater than u
You should be listening to what I'm saying.. I could save you a lot of money. But nah you should just listen to the mfg for the dyno and amm1.. he's not biased at all. ROFL.
Tony props to you. Laughing all the way to the bank.
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Load banks can also be made cheap with voicecoil wire and bifilar winding submerged in concrete... That's like 50 bucks tops.
Have fun spending thousands on tools when a little know how can save you a lot of money.
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Velleman HPS140I 99$
Craftsmen clamp meter 72$
Fluke 113 true rms meter 116$
Sorry just under 300$ and you can clamp your amps power for efficiency as well as many other tasks you can do with these three items vs the AMM1.
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I'm not against the amm1.. Seems like a neat tool.
However I am against people making videos misusing equipment and praising the equipment that was used properly. It's just low.
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The video is staying up. I will make sure to really hurt the clampers feelings when I test the AMM1 vs Clamping using a Subwoofer.
Point of this.
AMM1 very simple.
Clamping- To find the exact point, you have to video it and then go back to watch that video to try and find the point just before clipping. Pain in the ass.
It's honestly not hard... sigh. You better be getting kickbacks from amm1 sales. (or be selling them yourself) otherwise you are going to all this trouble for nothing.
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You are looking at about $5000 worth of testing equipment sitting on my make shift bench. I have the tools to do the job correctly, most people dont.thank you cj18, that's what I was trying to explain with my last post but you said it much better.
in short what im seeing is that with out the proper equipment (which gets expensive just for a good scope) you cant get an accurate results from the clamping that most people do. it can be a more accurate test with the right tools at hand and more work but for the money the amm1 is a steal.
all the scopes ive seen run around $300-400 for a nice one. don't forget the dmm and getting a test bench together to put a reactive load on the amp to get a true rms reading at a given load.
The AMM1 now provides an affordable solution that.
That's what i'm trying to say, with cost difference between the tools needed to get an accurate test the amm1 is a hands down winner.
Yes clamping with the right tools can give you More accurate result but still not 100% and not as cost effective. Let's face it us audio guys are always looking for a good way to save money while still getting the install done right. The amm1 helps do that plus some with ease and accuracy.
Sorry if anyone feels like i'm baking clamping, not trying to. It's the way of the past and inaccurate compared to the amm1. For a cost effective tool the amm1 is a steal.
Unless the amm1 is cheaper than 250 bucks then it's actually not the better deal. But if you honestly need something that can measure taking into account for the power factor then I guess spend the extra money. 99% of people don't do it and so the industry standard is basically clamping for voltamps.
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That is like a milisecond after the 651 pops up. And that is 683 watts at 4 ohms or 701 at 3.9 ohms. And even in the video I can tell the wave is just starting to clip.
So if you actually performed the test where the tone stopped when the dyno stopped then they both would have been within a few watts of each other.
And it's really not hard to use your eyes if you have the scope resolution set correctly. But again even through a YT video I can see when it starts clipping.
Not to mention how fast the tone used ramps up the signal voltage. If you were just rolling it up instead you could actually watch the wave.
Like Taylor said. Take the video down and do the test properly.
Do it like this. Dyno the amp. Figure the correct output voltage for the amp to be clean. Set your clamps and scope up and then get to that voltage showing it's clean. then go slightly over and watch the wave clip. Showing they are accurate with each other.
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Clamping Method vs SMD AD-1 Amp Dyno vs. SMD AMM-1 Audio Multimeter
in D'Amore Engineering - High Quality Car Audio Installation Tools & Accessories
Posted · Edited by SINTORMAN
This will be my last post in this thread. coming on SMD and reading all this is... well exactly what I knew SMD to be rofl. You can reply to my comments but I won't see them. Have fun guys.
PS have fun finding out things like how efficient your amps are or how much power your alt is producing with your amm1s, or repairing amplifiers and tracking down noise... oh wait... lol.