New member, intro and questions

[Loudcherokee]

Hello all! Been working on a system for my new truck, and have some issues that I'm struggling with. Was hoping for some advice. This is my first post, so I'll offer a little information first.

I've been into car audio for years, and have usually had a system of some sort in each vehicle I've owned. Im from the old school, back in the days of US Amps, Phoenix Gold amps, Clarion head units, PSI subs, or JL Audio if you had the cash, couldn't beat Infiity Kappa highs with the green cones back then, or MB Quart mid range and high end. Ive always built my own systems, enclosures, and done all my own wiring.

Now a days, I still enjoy my music clean, clear, crisp, and loud. I listen to a little bit of everything, mostly classic rock and sometimes 90s hip hop/R&B. Im not as much of a bass head as I used to be, with 4 12s in a W shaped enclosure stuffed into the back of a jeep Cherokee, but I still want to feel the thump from the low end in my system. Im used to running at least 2 12s in a large ported enclosure, and at one point had two solo baric L7 15s in the back of my 04 impala. Now, I have a Nissan Titan crew cab, and I'm trying to build a smaller system but am having some frustrations.

So far, I've replaced all door speakers with Kicker CS series 6.75 coaxials. I would normally run components but don't feel like cutting up my new truck to add tweets anywhere for flush mounts, and im currently not running an amp for my highs, but going off the factory head unit. More on that later. The kicker CS speakers are 3 ohm. Thats as close as I could find to the factory 2 ohm head unit. Expectedly, there is some volume drop, but the sound is much cleaner and the bass no longer creeps into and distorts the vocals.

For a sub, I've tapped into my rear speakers with a speaker wire to RCA plug and im utilizing the high level input on a Kicker CXA400.1 mono class d amp. Ive never done this before, as I usually just completely strip the stock system and put a new head unit, 4 channel, and mono amp in the vehicle.

This amp was pushing an alphasonik 10" in a small downfiring enclosure i found on Amazon. I picked this because it would fit under the rear seat and I was just looking for some kick to add some low end to my factory system. I didn't want to spend a ton and figured this would feed the need for those lows.

I was less than impressed with the alphasonik, and I expected to be. I had already planned to just take the sub out of the enclosure, and put something else in there, but ended up going a whole different route.

So now I have a JL 10Tw3-D4 in their power wedge enclosure under the back seat. This sub offered better sound, cleaner, more depth in sound, could hit a bit of a lower note, and just over all sounds better. But here's my issue - it still doesn't quite hit as low or as loud as what I'm looking for. Im not sure if its my amp, or the fact that I'm running off the factory head unit, or or maybe its just my expectations of what sound to expect from a 10" sub in a small sealed enclosure. Remember, I said im used to 12s in large ported boxes, usually facing the back of the car in a trunk? This sub is firing up into the back seat.

But then I remembered at one time having 2 JL 10W6s in a sealed enclosure, and man those things would rattle your brain. They would hit the low notes, you'd feel it in your chest, and they made you think you had 12s in the back. The JL W3T is a shallow mount dual 4 ohm sub that is several generations newer and purportedly will outperform their current W3 non-shallow mount sub. But the lows just aren't there. For example, the song Low by Flo-Rida or Get Low by Little Jon, the low bass note just isn't reproduced from this sub with any volume or feeling. Its therefore, but not in the way I would expect. Those are just two examples that I heard on my way to work tonight on SiriusXM.

So is it my amp, the fact that I've tapped into speaker wire to get my signal, the fact that I'm using the factory head unit at all, or am I just expecting more than what a 10" in a small truck wedge enclosure can do? These subs get amazing reviews all over, so I don't know if its the sub but I'm not sure.

A little about the amp- brand new Kicker CXA400.1 with a rated 400w RMS @ 1ohm that came with a "birth certificate" claiming 519w RMS. This is a roughly 30% increase from rated power, so I'm assuming the rated 300w RMS @ 2 ohm would increase as well. The JL sub is a 400w rms sub so i should be feeding it enough power..

The amp is wired with 8 gauge power cable, and the first time I set gain i used a digital multimeter and set the gain to 24.5 volts with a 50hz -6db test tone. This was only a hair of a turn from 0 on the gain knob. The RCA inputs from the speaker wire are feeding 6.9 volts to the high level input on the amp.

I have more to post on future plans, but will add more later.

LC

[Dafaseles]

Does that amp have a subsonic filter? Or a high pass crossover? 

Some stock head units will actually mute some bass at higher volumes to protect the crappy stock speakers. Not saying it is the problem, but it might be something to look into. You might need a line out converter that will override and fix the crappy output signal back to flat

[Loudcherokee]

3 hours ago, Dafaseles said:

Does that amp have a subsonic filter? Or a high pass crossover? 

Some stock head units will actually mute some bass at higher volumes to protect the crappy stock speakers. Not saying it is the problem, but it might be something to look into. You might need a line out converter that will override and fix the crappy output signal back to flat

Yes, it does have a subsonic filter and a low pass crossover set around 80ish hz. 

 

I've been curious about the head unit choking off some of the frequencies as well. This is why I've been strongly considering changing up my head unit all together. Im looking at the JVC KWv960bw pretty strongly, or the Pioneer AVIC-W8600nex. 

 

So another example, on the way home this morning, the song AYO Technology by 50 cent and Timberlake came on. I remember this song hitting pretty dang hard when I had 2 12s in the trunk of my car. That hard hitting low bass note is barely audible from this 10. Surely its not beyond the frequency limits of the sub? 

 

LC

[Dafaseles]

The subsonic filter, if you don't know (you probably do), but it's the same as a high pass filter. I don't know what you have that set at, but if you set it somewhere in the 20-25 hz range, that should be fine.... if you haven't already....

But yeah, the head unit could absolutely be the issue as well. These new cars with their "fancy sound systems" do whatever they can to be able to use the cheapest components and still have it sound "good" to the vast majority of people who don't crave the superior sound you get from going aftermarket. 

I personally would go aftermarket head unit. My third head unit was a pioneer and I'll never buy another brand (I don't think lol), but that's just my personal opinion. But there are also other options to keep the stock head unit, like an Audio Control DQ-61. Hooked up and tuned correctly, it'll fix the output signal. (My personal opinion, I'd still go with agm aftermarket head unit. Seems easier and less headache) 

[Loudcherokee]

29 minutes ago, Dafaseles said:

The subsonic filter, if you don't know (you probably do), but it's the same as a high pass filter. I don't know what you have that set at, but if you set it somewhere in the 20-25 hz range, that should be fine.... if you haven't already....

But yeah, the head unit could absolutely be the issue as well. These new cars with their "fancy sound systems" do whatever they can to be able to use the cheapest components and still have it sound "good" to the vast majority of people who don't crave the superior sound you get from going aftermarket. 

I personally would go aftermarket head unit. My third head unit was a pioneer and I'll never buy another brand (I don't think lol), but that's just my personal opinion. But there are also other options to keep the stock head unit, like an Audio Control DQ-61. Hooked up and tuned correctly, it'll fix the output signal. (My personal opinion, I'd still go with agm aftermarket head unit. Seems easier and less headache) 

 

On this amp, the subsonic filter is fixed internally. Only the low pass x-over is adjustable. 

 

Yeah I've always ran with either a Pioneer or JVC. Have had multiple of each brand. JVC used to be ahead of Pioneer in features and sound quality, but they're all about even now. With these two models, the only major difference is the JVC uses 5v pre amps vs the Pioneer at 4v. But the Pioneer has a couple of extra compatability features, but I'll likely never use those. 

 

LC

[Loudcherokee]

7 hours ago, Dafaseles said:

Does that amp have a subsonic filter? Or a high pass crossover? 

Some stock head units will actually mute some bass at higher volumes to protect the crappy stock speakers. Not saying it is the problem, but it might be something to look into. You might need a line out converter that will override and fix the crappy output signal back to flat

 

So I've been googling alot since you mentioned this. It looks like Nissan does roll off bass in the factory head unit. This could be some of my issue for sure. 

 

I understand I can get an LCI2 to fix the issue, but I'm not sure if I want to do that or just go ahead and get a new head unit. If I go the route of a new head unit, I will also need to replace the speakers I just put in since they're 3 ohm instead of 4 ohm, and I don't want to tax an $800 head unit with a lower ohm load. And, if im doing that, i may as well add a separate 4 channel amp while I'm at it. 

 

LC

[Dafaseles]

7 minutes ago, Loudcherokee said:

 

So I've been googling alot since you mentioned this. It looks like Nissan does roll off bass in the factory head unit. This could be some of my issue for sure. 

 

I understand I can get an LCI2 to fix the issue, but I'm not sure if I want to do that or just go ahead and get a new head unit. If I go the route of a new head unit, I will also need to replace the speakers I just put in since they're 3 ohm instead of 4 ohm, and I don't want to tax an $800 head unit with a lower ohm load. And, if im doing that, i may as well add a separate 4 channel amp while I'm at it. 

 

LC

If you add a decent 4 channel amp, then there's no reason to change out the new speakers. You're talking about the kicker coaxils you put in the doors right? 

[Loudcherokee]

9 minutes ago, Dafaseles said:

If you add a decent 4 channel amp, then there's no reason to change out the new speakers. You're talking about the kicker coaxils you put in the doors right? 

Yes, they are a 3 ohm speaker in the CS series. 

 

LC

[Dafaseles]

I was just looking at the CS series, all are rated 4 ohm. If you're looking at the DC resistance, yeah, it says 3.3 ohm. But that's fine. You can run those off any head unit with no issue. Though, they can run off 100 watts per channel as well. So it's really up to you.