New System

[Eric B]

yea i'd need 2 3500d, compared to 2 2200d. but i think i'd rather get the BTLs now and get the descent level of rms power to them then when i get more money buy larger amp/s for them to fully load them.

wat bout a Soundstream XXX-6500D to fully load 2 BTLs?

2 2200D would work on the BTL's jus build the box a lil bigger. BTL's are very efficient woofers and can get loud easy. I heard one off of 1700watts and it burped 147.X @ 42Hz on the TL...

[bmwkingaudio]

2 2200D would work on the BTL's jus build the box a lil bigger. BTL's are very efficient woofers and can get loud easy. I heard one off of 1700watts and it burped 147.X @ 42Hz on the TL...

ok thanx. how big of ported u think?

wat bout the soundstream amp?

[Bryan]

haha damn this thread is funny...if you really wanna go with the pioneers then go with the pioneers...you shouldnt let other people choose your system...but if you're still looking for reccomendations... I would reccomend you go with 2 of the AQ HDC3 12s instead of the bls or btls.

[Lynbo]

A few comments or ideas on your next system, it looks like you are looking at a daily system that is sick. Ok you are working with a 325 bmw I assume a trunk car and your subs will be in the trunk? Your current box is a sealed with two 12 Audiobahn subs with one amp driving them. Is this a pre-fabed box or one you built? And you want it louder so is your goal to be louder inside your car or outside. Going from a sealed to ported enclosure will gain some spl in that one step. Next as loganberry talked about power to your new equipment will become an issue, you are looking at adding huge load upon your car stock electrical. A few times you have ask about running 16-18v for your system your are stepping out of a daily system and into a competition vehicle territory, your system price just jumped why out of your posted budget.

You also seem to be focused on max power from your amps there are a few variables you may need to take into consideration on your system expectations. Stable voltage to your amp(s) will affect power available for your system so you max power will vary day to day. Extra batteries may help but remember this will become an added load onto your alternator. Speaker impedance will rise to some degree when using your system and this will also affect your max output. Ohms law will become a good guideline in your system design.

A few suggestions on your next system assuming you are building your next box regardless of the subs to be used. Use your current subs and build a new ported box for them, you may need to review with your local Audiobahn dealer for box recommendations. Review the forum on trunk installs for your sub and port direction. Take a look in your trunk see how the sound pressure from your subs will enter the interior of your car. You most likely will have a challenge on a pathway to your interior since bmw has made efforts to keep the cabin noise low. Also review on the forum the Big-3 and use some of your budget money to perform this step as it will help no matter what direction you go in your next system design. Look at this way this is your practice box, nothing worse than putting money out and building a box and find out it will not fit into your trunk or accidental damaging your new sub installing it into your box. The subs you have been thinking about or the ones suggested by other members are going to need a good solid box to get the most out of them. You will find in the car audio world that build test build again will be common so use your existing subs to hone your box building skills. Oh one more thing to remember the amp gain control is not a volume control, another topic worth reviewing.

My two cents on your next system good luck in your build.

[bmwkingaudio]

haha damn this thread is funny...if you really wanna go with the pioneers then go with the pioneers...you shouldnt let other people choose your system...but if you're still looking for reccomendations... I would reccomend you go with 2 of the AQ HDC3 12s instead of the bls or btls.

so ur a audioque guy? well i like there subs but i want ones that can handle more rms than that. but i was guna use audioque amps to power the btls.

and i kinda still wana try the pioneers, but i trust the peoples advice on here

[bmwkingaudio]

A few comments or ideas on your next system, it looks like you are looking at a daily system that is sick. Ok you are working with a 325 bmw I assume a trunk car and your subs will be in the trunk? Your current box is a sealed with two 12 Audiobahn subs with one amp driving them. Is this a pre-fabed box or one you built? And you want it louder so is your goal to be louder inside your car or outside. Going from a sealed to ported enclosure will gain some spl in that one step. Next as loganberry talked about power to your new equipment will become an issue, you are looking at adding huge load upon your car stock electrical. A few times you have ask about running 16-18v for your system your are stepping out of a daily system and into a competition vehicle territory, your system price just jumped why out of your posted budget.

You also seem to be focused on max power from your amps there are a few variables you may need to take into consideration on your system expectations. Stable voltage to your amp(s) will affect power available for your system so you max power will vary day to day. Extra batteries may help but remember this will become an added load onto your alternator. Speaker impedance will rise to some degree when using your system and this will also affect your max output. Ohms law will become a good guideline in your system design.

A few suggestions on your next system assuming you are building your next box regardless of the subs to be used. Use your current subs and build a new ported box for them, you may need to review with your local Audiobahn dealer for box recommendations. Review the forum on trunk installs for your sub and port direction. Take a look in your trunk see how the sound pressure from your subs will enter the interior of your car. You most likely will have a challenge on a pathway to your interior since bmw has made efforts to keep the cabin noise low. Also review on the forum the Big-3 and use some of your budget money to perform this step as it will help no matter what direction you go in your next system design. Look at this way this is your practice box, nothing worse than putting money out and building a box and find out it will not fit into your trunk or accidental damaging your new sub installing it into your box. The subs you have been thinking about or the ones suggested by other members are going to need a good solid box to get the most out of them. You will find in the car audio world that build test build again will be common so use your existing subs to hone your box building skills. Oh one more thing to remember the amp gain control is not a volume control, another topic worth reviewing.

My two cents on your next system good luck in your build.

thanx this was all real helpful.

yes, subs in the trunk. daily sick system. i wana be heard ha. i built the box. i want to be louder outside and inside.. but yea it is hard since bmws r made quite well at bein quiet inside. my car has a nice alt already considering the make, but u think upgrading it is necesary? or just another batt or two? idk impedance or ohms law. yes im guna build the new box. 6 cubic ft is as big as it can be so that i'll still hav room for the apms.. i'll look at the forum bout installs. wat is the big 3 again? explain wat ur talkin bout with the gain.. i know its not volume control but idk wat exactly it is

[Lynbo]

thanx this was all real helpful.

yes, subs in the trunk. daily sick system. i wana be heard ha. i built the box. i want to be louder outside and inside.. but yea it is hard since bmws r made quite well at bein quiet inside. my car has a nice alt already considering the make, but u think upgrading it is necesary? or just another batt or two? idk impedance or ohms law. yes im guna build the new box. 6 cubic ft is as big as it can be so that i'll still hav room for the apms.. i'll look at the forum bout installs. wat is the big 3 again? explain wat ur talkin bout with the gain.. i know its not volume control but idk wat exactly it is

To you alternator question in your original post you are thinking of running 3 Boss BLX5000 at 5000 watts each for combined 15,000 watts for your subs.

Using ohms law (watts divided by your voltage = amps) would indicted you would need 1250 amps supplying your amps at 12 volts or with your car running 1120 amps assuming your running voltage is mid 13 to low 14 volts I used 13.4 for reference. Now these are just reference numbers amp design will change these numbers based on their design efficiency, speaker load and voltage supplied to the amplifier. Your alternator from BMW was installed for one purpose, to supply power to the cars stock electrical there maybe 20-30% of reserve capacity. In the end there will not be enough volts/amps to supply a large stereo system for a long period of time, batteries will help for a short time until there voltage supply begins to run low. This action will become added load on you alternator; low system voltage will cause all sorts of problems not just with your stereo but your cars electrical system as well. Running large amounts of watts will require a strong electrical system to support it and should be included into your design.

Sorry to bring all this bad news on you system design. I am facing similar issues in my system design for a bass racer that I am going to be building for next season in dB drags. The engine ECU controls my car alternator output voltage so I cannot replace with a HO alternator nor do I have the room for a second alternator under my hood. So I have changed my system total power to reduce the load on my alternator, I will still be using a two-battery setup. My basic viewpoint of system design is what load can my car support and how much room am I going to allow for my subwoofers. Next what are my options on electrical upgrades, then the fun stuff picking the subs/amps.

I have never used Audiobahn or boss products in the past so I cannot offer any comments in your design. The only thing I can offer is to start attending some car stereo shows in your area and/or more research on the forum as to equipment to be considered in you next build. I’m in northern cali so there are some dominant brands here and for good reason they have survived the test of ground pounding or the lanes. Some brands to think about: Rockford Fosgate, Sundown, and Stetsom for amps. Fi, DD, DC Audio for subs. This is just the tip of the audio iceberg but just a few of the companies I am thinking of using in my build. Bottom line go with a company that has proven itself in competition. Keep in mind to focus on the street class, just my little humble opinion with the upper level classes hard to tell if they are using off the shelve items or modified products not availble to the public.

Impedance on your speakers will vary from there nominal rating. Here is the technical side I maybe a little lacking on but here it goes your subs when you first turn on you system will be a rating close to there original factor rating. But as you begin playing your system the voice coils warm up and will affect you impedance value and next is the different frequencies that are played through you subs this to will change your impedance values. So my two cents is heat and frequency will vary your impendence load upon your amp during your listen time period. Other things that will affect it is the speaker design itself and what cooling design was built within your sub and your sub box design will affect it to some degree. Hope this made a little sense, just be aware that your amp will see many different loads and conditions it will have to work in on a daily basis.

The big 3 is a process of adding (suggested) 1/0 gauge wire to your electrical system to improve your voltage/current transfer from your alternator to your battery(s). By adding and not replacing to your existing car cabling your cars alternator electrical will take the path of least resistance the larger cable. The 3 wires would be:

1. Positive battery post to your positive on the alternator

2. Battery negative to ground

3. Engine block to ground.

Spend some time on the tutorial in the electrical-battery-alternators-wiring, very helpful.

Your front stage you did not mention what you are running for your mid/high and head unit and if you have amp for you mid/highs?

Hope this helps a little

[Bryan]

so ur a audioque guy? well i like there subs but i want ones that can handle more rms than that. but i was guna use audioque amps to power the btls.

and i kinda still wana try the pioneers, but i trust the peoples advice on here

yea im an audioque guy but i dont suggest aq everytime someone asks for what sub to buy.....but the 1k rms is very underrated..you can put 2k on the hdc3, and upwards of 3k but thats pushing the limits...

[bmwkingaudio]

yea im an audioque guy but i dont suggest aq everytime someone asks for what sub to buy.....but the 1k rms is very underrated..you can put 2k on the hdc3, and upwards of 3k but thats pushing the limits...

if u put a 2000 rms load on the hdc3s do u think they'd be louder than the btls?

and how much more of a load than 2000rms can u put on btls?

[bmwkingaudio]

To you alternator question in your original post you are thinking of running 3 Boss BLX5000 at 5000 watts each for combined 15,000 watts for your subs.

Using ohms law (watts divided by your voltage = amps) would indicted you would need 1250 amps supplying your amps at 12 volts or with your car running 1120 amps assuming your running voltage is mid 13 to low 14 volts I used 13.4 for reference. Now these are just reference numbers amp design will change these numbers based on their design efficiency, speaker load and voltage supplied to the amplifier. Your alternator from BMW was installed for one purpose, to supply power to the cars stock electrical there maybe 20-30% of reserve capacity. In the end there will not be enough volts/amps to supply a large stereo system for a long period of time, batteries will help for a short time until there voltage supply begins to run low. This action will become added load on you alternator; low system voltage will cause all sorts of problems not just with your stereo but your cars electrical system as well. Running large amounts of watts will require a strong electrical system to support it and should be included into your design.

Sorry to bring all this bad news on you system design. I am facing similar issues in my system design for a bass racer that I am going to be building for next season in dB drags. The engine ECU controls my car alternator output voltage so I cannot replace with a HO alternator nor do I have the room for a second alternator under my hood. So I have changed my system total power to reduce the load on my alternator, I will still be using a two-battery setup. My basic viewpoint of system design is what load can my car support and how much room am I going to allow for my subwoofers. Next what are my options on electrical upgrades, then the fun stuff picking the subs/amps.

I have never used Audiobahn or boss products in the past so I cannot offer any comments in your design. The only thing I can offer is to start attending some car stereo shows in your area and/or more research on the forum as to equipment to be considered in you next build. I’m in northern cali so there are some dominant brands here and for good reason they have survived the test of ground pounding or the lanes. Some brands to think about: Rockford Fosgate, Sundown, and Stetsom for amps. Fi, DD, DC Audio for subs. This is just the tip of the audio iceberg but just a few of the companies I am thinking of using in my build. Bottom line go with a company that has proven itself in competition. Keep in mind to focus on the street class, just my little humble opinion with the upper level classes hard to tell if they are using off the shelve items or modified products not availble to the public.

Impedance on your speakers will vary from there nominal rating. Here is the technical side I maybe a little lacking on but here it goes your subs when you first turn on you system will be a rating close to there original factor rating. But as you begin playing your system the voice coils warm up and will affect you impedance value and next is the different frequencies that are played through you subs this to will change your impedance values. So my two cents is heat and frequency will vary your impendence load upon your amp during your listen time period. Other things that will affect it is the speaker design itself and what cooling design was built within your sub and your sub box design will affect it to some degree. Hope this made a little sense, just be aware that your amp will see many different loads and conditions it will have to work in on a daily basis.

The big 3 is a process of adding (suggested) 1/0 gauge wire to your electrical system to improve your voltage/current transfer from your alternator to your battery(s). By adding and not replacing to your existing car cabling your cars alternator electrical will take the path of least resistance the larger cable. The 3 wires would be:

1. Positive battery post to your positive on the alternator

2. Battery negative to ground

3. Engine block to ground.

Spend some time on the tutorial in the electrical-battery-alternators-wiring, very helpful.

Your front stage you did not mention what you are running for your mid/high and head unit and if you have amp for you mid/highs?

Hope this helps a little

haha this is alot to understand, but thanx for all the help. i am changing my amps and subs. i want to run at 14 volts and my total rms power is goin to be 4400. so my amps would be 315? i would assume audioque amps r built efficiently.. wat is the speaker load? how do i find out how many amps/volts my car is already making from the alt? the longest i normally hav my system runnin is a hour at a time.

for my box, i think 6 cu ft. i was plannin on the ports on each vertical side. would i want them facing towards my car interior, or towards the trunk?

and im still not sure on impedance. by speakers u mean my subs? when i fisrt turn on my system it will be close to its nominal rating? by frequencies u r talkin about hz? idk wat hz to tune it to. idk wat my systems impedance values r? how could my box design help? like how efficient it is? the btls ive chosen hav good cooling. how can i be sure my amps can handle the loads? on doin the big 3, my cars stock battery placement is in the trunk already. would i hav to run the wire from the alt all the way back thru to the trunk? and do i hav to wire from the alt and to the ground from all the batteries i hav? or just one?..

my car came with the harmon/kardon upgraded system so all my mid/highs r stock. so idk wat size or how much watts im running there becaus those r powered from the stock amp too. and rite now i hav a kenwood deck, but i want to install a valor NVG-720W