Power - True or False ?

[Botev12]

Hi all.

I need someone to verify and help me on the power matter for my car and stereo.

Today im running my equipment on the stock battery in my car. It's a 100Ah stock mercedes "high capacity" battery. The alternator on the car im not sure how big, but according to VIN check on the equipment codes for my car i also have a larger alternator than standard.

My problem today is power. When my cars running its struggeling with dimming lights and engine revs dropping, even at speeds with higher revs I notice it.

So my local Audio dealer recomended me getting new batteries. Of course selling his own brand. So in order to sort this power issue im thinking of getting 2 batteris. One for the car and one for the stereo. Finaly i can play with the sound lvl i want to. Untill i read on different stereo forums on web, where someone said that more/new batteriers don't help on power, only for how long u can play.

Now this worries me. Cause it makes sence in one way, but thinking that more batteries should also help on power.

Im running 0/1Gauge powercable from the battery, which is in the boot with the stereo, split into three 4 Gauge going into the amplifiers. Each of the monoblocks for the subs is connected to a 1 Farad capacitator each.

Can some one please help me on this matter ? Will batteries help ? if so, any recomendation on what i should go for ? Optima ? Maxxima ? other types?

Or do i have to start with the powercables thats running through my car from the engine to the back of my battery in the boot ?

I know its a wise and good idea to maybe get a bigger powercable from alternator to the battery, and alt to chassis, but this would be a HUGE job for me, so if new batteries will help me more than my current situation thats what i wanna do.

U can check my install here : http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=3982...mp;l=1e0caa7791

In advance , thanks.

Best regards , Anders .

Edited January 8, 2010 by Botev12

[bobonit]

Could you post what amps you have and what their current rating is? Then we can see how much is needed.

Adding a 2nd battery helps to an extent, but if your dimming lights and dropping revs, you may even need to look into a high output alternator. The 2nd battery will only postpone the dimming, but it will still happen, then your alternator will have to work longer to charge your batteries back up, assuming that you turn your stereo off long enough for let it charge the batteries. If you are cranking the tunes constantly while driving, you may not even be letting the batteries charge back up.

[audiofanaticz]

Hi all.

I need someone to verify and help me on the power matter for my car and stereo.

Today im running my equipment on the stock battery in my car. It's a 100Ah stock mercedes "high capacity" battery. The alternator on the car im not sure how big, but according to VIN check on the equipment codes for my car i also have a larger alternator than standard.

My problem today is power. When my cars running its struggeling with dimming lights and engine revs dropping, even at speeds with higher revs I notice it.

So my local Audio dealer recomended me getting new batteries. Of course selling his own brand. So in order to sort this power issue im thinking of getting 2 batteris. One for the car and one for the stereo. Finaly i can play with the sound lvl i want to. Untill i read on different stereo forums on web, where someone said that more/new batteriers don't help on power, only for how long u can play.

Now this worries me. Cause it makes sence in one way, but thinking that more batteries should also help on power.

Im running 0/1Gauge powercable from the battery, which is in the boot with the stereo, split into three 4 Gauge going into the amplifiers. Each of the monoblocks for the subs is connected to a 1 Farad capacitator each.

Can some one please help me on this matter ? Will batteries help ? if so, any recomendation on what i should go for ? Optima ? Maxxima ? other types?

Or do i have to start with the powercables thats running through my car from the engine to the back of my battery in the boot ?

I know its a wise and good idea to maybe get a bigger powercable from alternator to the battery, and alt to chassis, but this would be a HUGE job for me, so if new batteries will help me more than my current situation thats what i wanna do.

U can check my install here : http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=3982...mp;l=1e0caa7791

In advance , thanks.

Best regards , Anders .

Nice clean looking install to start with!

First thing Im going to suggust is to loose the capacitors. Cheaper capacitors dont do much, and often times hurt the install more then help it! Capacitors instantly drain on a single bass note. Already having a lacking charging system a capacitor is just going to hurt it that much more.

XS Power and Kinetik both make great car audio batteries. I prefer the XS Batteries over Kinetik, some like Kinetik better. These are the 2 main battery companies being used in car audio today. You cant go wrong with any of these batteries.

There are also some other battery companies such as Stinger, Odyssey, and Hawker. However Enersys is the main manufacture, and those 3 listed companies buy the batteries from Enersys and put their own name on them. You will find that Stingers are the most expensive, then odyssey a little cheaper, and hawker cheaper yet.

The 2nd thing Im going to suggust after removing your capacitors is upgrade your battery under the hood, XS Power or Kinetik should have a battery that will fit in your stock location.

Also do the wiring upgrade under your hood called the "Big 3". Upgrading your alternator wire to the battery, a new ground from your battery to your chassis, and a ground from your engine to your battery is going to stiffen up your electrical system all together. Keep your factory wires intact when you do this, the factory wires will still help reduce resistance. It seems that a lot of audio shops either dont know about this wiring upgrade, or just dont care to do it, but it is key to having a good electrical system, even if you have a stock alternator.

Im not aware if you did your install or a shop, but another good thing to check is your ground location for your amps. It is bad to just screw a ground wire the vehicles body with a self taping screw. So many people do this, and it hurts performance bad.

The best way to ground your amps is with a separate run of ground wire from front to back, if you have a rear battery run a ground from front battery to rear battery as well as ground the rear battery to the chassis too. If this is something you dont feel like doing the next best thing to do is ground directly to the vehicles frame and be sure to grind away any rust or paint for the best connection possible before bolting (not screwing) the ground to the frame.

Most vehicles stock alternator will support a 2nd medium size battery in the rear as well as the stock battery up front. A quality battery will have a faster discharge rate, and discharge more current then a factory battery that has maybe 900 warm cranking amps if your lucky.

While its true that a battery will improve the duration you can bump your music, but it will also help take some of the load your alternator has to do. What you really want to shoot for is running your stereo off of battery power, and having your alternator a way to maintain your batteries capacity and kept charge.

There is a module out called the MLA that works on both high output alternators and factory alternators. What it does is makes your alternator charge at a slightly higher voltage. Higher voltage results in needing less current to make the same amount of power. Im not sure if one is available for your car however.

By just removing your capacitors, doing the big 3 upgrage, and ensuring you have proper grounds for your amps I can assure you that you will notice a huge difference in your voltage drops. Adding a nice agm battery under the hood like xs power will make a world of difference! From there you can go on to see if you will need a 2nd battery in the back, or maybe a highoutput alternator.

Of coarse its always wise to have a good alternator, but they do get expensive, but will make a night and day difference!

Edited January 8, 2010 by Audiofanaticz

[audiofanaticz]

Could you post what amps you have and what their current rating is? Then we can see how much is needed.

His amps are 2 Pioneer Premier PRS-D1000s

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_7420_P...PRS-D1000M.html

[Botev12]

Im running all Monster cable and pioneer. The capacitators is also monster, they was one of the good ones when i bought em. I was thinking of trying with out them, but havent gotten that far yet.

I allways let my battery get som charge before i shut it of. And though i would like to play like steve meade all the time, I also build my system to play at normal music lvl, to enjoy a good sound. Which it does..

But its when i turn it up, to have some fun being the basshead i sometimes am.

Heres a link of my system setup, it didnt come on the first post.

My car is a W208 Mercedes Benz CLK 200 Kompressor 2000 mod. Which has one battery in the trunk, which is the main and only. Running a new powercable will be a hasle, but the best i know. Uprating the alt wires to ground and engine ground is on my to do list. My Ground is more than good enough, got a friend which is a Nasca judge who took a look at it one time.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=1068...mp;id=870775186

Hope this makes more sense.

Edited January 8, 2010 by Botev12

[audiofanaticz]

The capacitators is also monster, they was one of the good ones when i bought em.

Well your first problem is you continuing thinking that capacitors help.

When I say a "good capacitor" I mean something along the lines of Xstatic batcap "the cap" by alumapro or the rockford fosgate . Those are real capacitors.

One of the small kinetik batteries for a comparison are 100times stronger then a 1 farad capacitor like you are using.

These little capacitors are nothing but a gimmick to spend money on something that really serves no purpose. Thats why hardly anyone uses them anymore.

Mosnter cable wiring is also another gimmick.

They claim "Patented Magnetic Flux Tube® allows for greater current transfer"

All your buying is a power wire with a plastic tube down the middle giving you less strand count and less wire, for a bigger price tag. If this plastic tube gives you a greater current transfer other wire manufactures would be doing the same thing.

Their rca's are over priced, the only good thing about monster cable rca's is if you end up having a frayed cord or it stops working for some reason you can exchange it over the counter at any dealer without questions asked. However I am still unaware if they still have that warranty, and even if they do it doesnt justafy paying the extreme mark up for the cables when your standard $10 rca cords sound just as good as the $30+ cords.

Didnt notice that battery in the trunk part at first, but with that being in the trunk and no battery upfront, Im guessing this is causing most of your dimming problems. Since the battery is in the rear its nice and close to your amps which is a bonus. However the battery is draining faster then it can be charged. Part of the charging issue maybe caused by a small gauge wire being ran from your alternator to your battery. Most likely its just a factory 4 gauge wire, 2gauge if your lucky. So just running a nice run of 1/0 front to back may help a lot!

Edited January 9, 2010 by Audiofanaticz

[ISO]

Hey Audiofanaticz I don't want to step on your toes man but if he does his wirring rite and has the rite amount of battery power I feel he should just leave the 2 1 farad caps in his install unless he can get his money back for them.

There is no reason why they should hurt his system at all. Not trying to step on your toes as I have respect for you but he is not going to be harmed by those caps.

Anyhow I just got done checking out his amps and he's running 2 600 watt RMS sub amps and a 125x2 stereo amp.

As long as you put a high quality battery upfront inplace of your starter battery, that will make a huge difference.

You want to find out about what the Big III is as its important in any car nomatter what as it helps the flow of current and helping the flow of current can never hurt.

Last you want to use 1/0 power wire from front to back going to your distrobution block and to be on the safe side I would add an extra battery if you want to keep the capacitors and the battery doesn't need to go in the back. If you can fit it in the engine compartment I would rather see it there.

If a shop did your work I would check the grounds on all your amps and make sure they are connected to bare metal. I use a bolt, washers and lock nuts and for an install thats not mine I use a ring terminal on my ground wire.

My favorite battery of all time for compact situations is the Stinger SP1000 and its a beast of a battery and very reliable if you can get 2 of those under your hood you shouldn't have any current storage issues. I recommend Power Master too and am sure that what ever battery that they offer that is the same physical size should be able to go toe to toe with the Stinger SP1000. I do recommend staying away from Kinetik as I am just not comfortable with their batteries and never have been.

Do the Big 3 out of 1/0 gauge wire and run 1/0 gauge to the boot where your distrobution blocks are and try and fit 2 batteries in that car with one replacing the starter battery and you will be fine. With this done you can leave the Caps in so you don't have to change the way things look in the boot. Theres only a very small chance that they will hurt your performance if you do these upgrades.

You amps;

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Pro...RS-D1000M?tab=B

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Pro.../GM-5200T?tab=B

Brian anything you find unexceptable?

[ISO]

Sorry I didn't realize your battery wasn't in your engine compartment.

Still you need something similiar to 2 Stinger SP1000s or Power Masters in that car.

LOL Brian aka Audiofanatics knows his stuff and the only thing I'll argue with him about is useing Kinetik batteries. Call it instinct or what ever you want but I have never been comfortable with Kinetiks batteries.

Edited January 9, 2010 by ISO

[audiofanaticz]

Sorry I didn't realize your battery wasn't in your engine compartment.

Still you need something similiar to 2 Stinger SP1000s or Power Masters in that car.

LOL Brian aka Audiofanatics knows his stuff and the only thing I'll argue with him about is useing Kinetik batteries. Call it instinct or what ever you want but I have never been comfortable with Kinetiks batteries.

I myself hate kinetik. I think I said it in one of my replies. Just listed them because they are some of the most used batteries in car audio. All XS Power batteries in my vehicle no kinetik.

only reason Im saying ditch the capacitors is because he already has a lacking electrical system and its not even that much power. The capacitors are just another draw that can be replaced with a decent brand battery and will stabilize voltage a lot better. If you want to use a capacitor to stop your lights from dimming, then hook it up to the main power wire that goes to your vehicles fuse center under the hood. Lol.

As you said Iso, Stingers are great batteries, but you can get the same battery cheaper going directly thru the source and bypassing the stinger hype markup

EDIT: Just seen in your sig Iso.

A cap is only good if you have 0 voltage loss and want to clean up the power at the peaks of the ripples..

He has mad voltage drop so his caps dont do much

Edited January 9, 2010 by Audiofanaticz

[ISO]

I myself hate kinetik. I think I said it in one of my replies. Just listed them because they are some of the most used batteries in car audio. All XS Power batteries in my vehicle no kinetik.

only reason Im saying ditch the capacitors is because he already has a lacking electrical system and its not even that much power. The capacitors are just another draw that can be replaced with a decent brand battery and will stabilize voltage a lot better. If you want to use a capacitor to stop your lights from dimming, then hook it up to the main power wire that goes to your vehicles fuse center under the hood. Lol.

As you said Iso, Stingers are great batteries, but you can get the same battery cheaper going directly thru the source and bypassing the stinger hype markup

EDIT: Just seen in your sig Iso.

He has mad voltage drop so his caps dont do much

HA HA HA ROFL to the part in bold, I think this got brought up in a thread about sticking a cap on the positive wire going to each one of the headlights as a joke to stop them from dimming. LOL

Brian I gotcha on the huge voltage drop!

Ya and to the OP you can get the Stinger SP1000 for a lot better price by going with the company that makes the actual battery and Audiofanaticz gave you the links above.

LOL I'm a brand whore, a Stinger brand whore to boot LOL and yes I'm willing to pay an extra $50 or $100 just so I have matching stuff and no I'm not rich actually only have $4 in my bank account and no job. LOL

I too have switched over to Power Master XS power batteries and run a D2400 as my starter battery in my truck but I don't recommend it for a small car as its a very, very big battery physcally and I also own one of their smaller batteries the D925 that I use for my test bench and I must say I have never used such a small battery that is as ballzy as the D925.

Since I use it on my test bench it gets used for any unexpected issues that arise with the most remarkable issue was our tractor LOL. The tractor battery was dead and its huge and the easiest thing for me to do was to grab my D925 and the farmers around here looked at the size and doubted it but by god it ran that damn tractor like it was no joke cause it ain't no joke of a battery but for the long run you will want something bigger.