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I've been doing extensive research on my next system build as its going to be the biggest and most technical build I've done. I've run into a lot of snags in my planning and was hoping this forum would be the perfect place for this. I have a pretty solid of foundation for equipment I would like to use, just having trouble on the power side of things. I have a 2009 Crown Vic Police Interceptor with the stock 190a alt and electrical system. I plan to run 2 Sundown SA-12 V2 D4 subs wired down to 1 ohm on a Skar RP2000.1D (2k RMS all day). I've read around and the opinions on how to handle the power vary greatly. Some say throw a couple good batteries in the trunk and it will be fine, others say upgrade the alternator and a good battery in the trunk, others say stock battery and alternator will be fine. I daily this vehicle and there I do a lot of city driving and deal with stop and go traffic often, I do not want to struggle with powering the system at red lights or while idling. I would like to be able to power this system under all running conditions that being city driving, highway driving, or idling. 

 

I have looked into high output alternators and I can find them for my vehicle but there are 2 problems with this option. First problem is that the only alternator making the 370a alternator I need is by JS Alternators and they don't use

 factory PCM voltage regulators which causes problems in Fords unfortunately. Second problem is that Mechman makes a PCM compatible alternator for my car but only in 240a. Now before anyone questions why I need a 370 amp altenator.. CVPIs can touch up at 100a full accessory load that being high beams, ac full blast, radio turned up, etc. so people who have measured told me (CVPI Group). Like mentioned idle output is a factor for me in this build as I dont feel like burning up Alternators once a year. 

 

I've also looked into a dual alt setup from a Lincoln Towncar Limo. Crown Vic Police Cars and Towncars are identical part for part mechanically so this would work.. I would run the 240a Mechman and have it regulated by the PCM but the electrical system separate to a battery in the trunk to power the system off the second alt and leave the stock alt for the car and a mid/high amp later on. Problem with this is that the bracket is a pain to find, instructions on installation, wiring and belt sizing instructions are impossible to find or useless, and I cant find the harness that splits one 6G connector into two. There's videos and pictures of these setups everywhere but almost nothing on installing the setup. I know this option is total overkill but would be cool and would guarantee 0 strain on my cars electrical system which is a priority in this build. 

 

Overall I'm not sure where to go with the build, I know what I want just not how to execute it properly. Sorry for such the long posting, any and all input is greatly appreciated. 

Edited by ohruma

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I have had a 390 amp JS alternator in my Ford Expedition for a while. No problems. About to put a diode on its sense wire to raise my voltage to about 15.3. If their alternators would cause that vehicle a problem then they wouldn’t make them for that vehicle. They special make their alternators for certain vehicles. Email them. Brand x makes special order alternators too. Message them on Facebook messaged to get a quote. And even on full tilt on that system with all that vehicles electronics on that that 240 amp alternator would be more than sufficient. After impedance rise and voltage drop, that amp won’t hardly pull any current. Also, Whatever amperage readings you see on amp dynos are sinusoidal signals. Music consumption is about half that draw. So on music that amp doesn’t pull hardly any current to be worrying about a high output alternator. And that factory alternator and an extra agm battery is the most you need for that amp. I’ve watched people with 240 amp alternators on amps quadruple the rms of yours and just have some battery reserve do just fine. 


:stupid:“How can we help you?”
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“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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I would put a taramps smart 3 on them subwoofers and run that mechman 240 and a 120ah agm battery. Or instead of that mechman, if you bent on wanting a bigger alternator then special order one from JS by emailing them or special order one from brand x off of Facebook messenger. That Skar rp2000.1d isn’t enough for them subwoofers. You have to differ in impedance rise and voltage drop, also, the fact that they can handle more than rated even after impedance rise and voltage drop. 


:stupid:“How can we help you?”
:+1:
 
“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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2 minutes ago, 1point21gigawatts said:

I have had a 390 amp JS alternator in my Ford Expedition for a while. No problems. About to put a diode on its sense wire to raise my voltage to about 15.3. If their alternators would cause that vehicle a problem then they wouldn’t make them for that vehicle. They special make their alternators for certain vehicles. Email them. Brand x makes special order alternators too. Message them on Facebook messaged to get a quote. And even on full tilt on that system with all that vehicles electronics on that that 240 amp alternator would be more than sufficient. After impedance rise and voltage drop, that amp won’t hardly pull any current. Also, Whatever amperage readings you see on amp dynos are sinusoidal signals. Music consumption is about half that draw. So on music that amp doesn’t pull hardly any current to be worrying about a high output alternator. And that factory alternator and an extra agm battery is the most you need for that amp. I’ve watched people with 240 amp alternators on amps quadruple the rms of yours and just have some battery reserve do just fine. 

Guy in the Crown Vic Group I'm in has a JS 390a on his CVPI and it gives him a battery light, could be a specific case for him though I haven't heard of any others. There's no info on the site that can reassure me of Plug N Play like Mechman where it says in the description "RETAINS FACTORY PCM CONTROL" yada yada

 

So I'm clear... my stock 190a alt (it might even be the 200a I've never checked which one I have) with a better battery under the hood and a second in the trunk will power my system no problems even at idle? I'm really not into headlights dimming at idle to the point that I do what others may call unnecessary to prevent it. 

 

Would the 240a from Mechman be worth it to invest in for the extra 40-50a of headroom? 

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Or you could call CES alternators and see if they can help you too. 
1 (216) 524-9576

 


:stupid:“How can we help you?”
:+1:
 
“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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1 minute ago, 1point21gigawatts said:

I would put a taramps smart 3 on them subwoofers and run that mechman 240 and a 120ah agm battery. Or instead of that mechman, if you bent on wanting a bigger alternator then special order one from JS by emailing them or special order one from brand x off of Facebook messenger. That Skar rp2000.1d isn’t enough for them subwoofers. You have to differ in impedance rise and voltage drop, also, the fact that they can handle more than rated even after impedance rise and voltage drop. 

I've heard Sundown aggressively under rates their subs and can handle 2X the RMS rating on them lol. I've actually emailed a handful of these brands your mentioning for alts I'm just restless and love as much information from as many places as I can. 

 

Feel free to correct any of this because I know very little about the technicalities behind it all but...

If I got 2 of the D4 (4ohm DVC) and wired them in series to 1 ohm wouldn't that give me the 2k RMS @ 1 ohm the amp is rated for? Based off your replies I'm not accounting for something I'm completely unaware of.

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1 minute ago, ohruma said:

Guy in the Crown Vic Group I'm in has a JS 390a on his CVPI and it gives him a battery light, could be a specific case for him though I haven't heard of any others. There's no info on the site that can reassure me of Plug N Play like Mechman where it says in the description "RETAINS FACTORY PCM CONTROL" yada yada

 

So I'm clear... my stock 190a alt (it might even be the 200a I've never checked which one I have) with a better battery under the hood and a second in the trunk will power my system no problems even at idle? I'm really not into headlights dimming at idle to the point that I do what others may call unnecessary to prevent it. 

 

Would the 240a from Mechman be worth it to invest in for the extra 40-50a of headroom? 

That must be that certain Ford model. And Yes, buying a good 240 amp alternator would be worth the investment. Plus it would have better idle output. I would honestly go bigger because to have room to upgrade the setup in the future because I couldn’t stay on a 2000 or 3000 rms amp without wanting more.


:stupid:“How can we help you?”
:+1:
 
“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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5 minutes ago, ohruma said:

I've heard Sundown aggressively under rates their subs and can handle 2X the RMS rating on them lol. I've actually emailed a handful of these brands your mentioning for alts I'm just restless and love as much information from as many places as I can. 

 

Feel free to correct any of this because I know very little about the technicalities behind it all but...

If I got 2 of the D4 (4ohm DVC) and wired them in series to 1 ohm wouldn't that give me the 2k RMS @ 1 ohm the amp is rated for? Based off your replies I'm not accounting for something I'm completely unaware of.

Even though the subwoofers are wired at 1 ohm the impedance rises while its playing. Different subwoofers and different enclosure produce different rises. Some could rise to almost 10 ohms from 1 ohm. Or the rise could be 2 ohms from 1 ohm. It ranges and there really isn’t an average or way to figure rise without actually measuring the finished product. But most of the 1 ohm rises I’ve seen in regular custom built ported enclosures are about 2.5-3 ohms. 

Edited by 1point21gigawatts

:stupid:“How can we help you?”
:+1:
 
“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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2 minutes ago, 1point21gigawatts said:

That must be that certain Ford model. And Yes, buying a good 240 amp alternator would be worth the investment. Plus it would have better idle output. I would honestly go bigger because to have room to upgrade the setup in the future because I couldn’t stay on a 2000 or 3000 rms amp without wanting more.

I'm not going for any CRAZY sound pressures or DB readings by any means. I love a good trunk trying to leave the hinges but ONLY when I adjust the knob to such. Daily driving i don't plan on getting myself pulled over which the cops here WILL do if they can feel it. I want a system that can do both at the twist of the knob.

 

6 minutes ago, 1point21gigawatts said:

That must be that certain Ford model. And Yes, buying a good 240 amp alternator would be worth the investment. Plus it would have better idle output. I would honestly go bigger because to have room to upgrade the setup in the future because I couldn’t stay on a 2000 or 3000 rms amp without wanting more.

CVPIs went through a lot of electrical revisions in the mid 2000s. 2004 they started using a 190 or 200a Alt manufactured by Mitsubishi and it used some new Internal Voltage Regulator that I guess isn't on any civilian Ford model vehicles or at least not with the programming the PCM looks for. 

 

4 minutes ago, 1point21gigawatts said:

Even though the subwoofers are wired at 1 ohm the impedance rises while its playing. Different subwoofer and different enclosure produce different rises. Some could rise to almost 10 ohms from 1 ohm. Or the rise could be 2.5 ohms from 1 ohm. It ranges and there really isn’t an average or way to figure rise without actually measuring the finished product. But most of the 1 ohm rises I’ve seen are about 2.5-3 ohms. 

With this in mind.... what would I want to push these subs with and what would need to be done if anything differently to accommodate that power demand?

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But for that amp you want, no need to upgrade your alternator, just add a big agm battery. On that taramps smart 3, add a 240 amp alternator and a 120ah agm battery and you would still have a little bit of room to upgrade. But I would want a lot of room to upgrade. You never know when that car audio itch will come. And when it comes, you have to scratch it or go crazy. 


:stupid:“How can we help you?”
:+1:
 
“And don’t forget to tell them that 
the customer isn’t always right.”

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