grizzleyadams69 Posted August 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Aluminum coils are lighter weight than copper and thus can be more efficient.Copper can dissipate heat a lil better and thus can take a bit more current. As far as musicality to your ears, you will most likely never hear a difference. i like blunt, straight forward answers. thank you Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forevrbumpn Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I hear a pretty noticeable difference, copper always has a lower Fs, and usually gains Bl, so usually sounds better in sealed, or smaller ported boxes due to added weight, and Bl But I thought copper had less heat dissipation? thats why aluminum was better for that purpose? its been about 4-5 years since we tested at the shop power testing, so Iam kind of rusty on copper/alum side by side testing But I personally like the copper coil sound better SMD woofer wont be copper at all anyways- is it? Quote I have a ritual called "terminator". I crouch in the shower in the "naked terminator" pose. With eyes closed I crouch for a minute and visualize either Arnie or the guy from the 2nd movie. I then start to hum the T2 theme. Slowly I rise to a standing position and open my eyes. It helps me get through my day. The only problem is if the shower curtain sticks to my terminator leg. It sorta ruins the fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rose-Villian Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) Ive Seen The FINAL Product of the SMD Woofer... and ITS FU(KIN SEXY!!!!!! Lets Just Say People WILL be like " WHAT THE FU(K" Edited August 4, 2009 by Rose-Villian Quote WWW.OSGINDUSTRIES.COM I LOVE HATER'S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHR Ed Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I've always tested my copper coils at a lower temp than alum right after high powered burps. And yes, the lower weight of the alum will change the Fs and Bl, but these are also changed by cone material and mass, former, coil size, suspension. So if all that is the same, and just the coils are different, the weight difference is so minimal, that it has barely any noticeable change on an RTA, let alone the human ear. Quote Ed Lester ShowtimeSPL Host Showtime Electronics Video MarketingMy old Build Loghttp://www.stevemead...08/#entry511451http://www.youtube.com/showtimespl 5 time dB Drag Finalist Last ride 2007 HHR, current dB 153.5 and bass race 149.4 dB. 153.0 dB on music New Ride, 2008 HHR SS. Build under way. Loudest score ever = 171dB 2009 dB Drag Racing, North American Points Champion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forevrbumpn Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I've always tested my copper coils at a lower temp than alum right after high powered burps. And yes, the lower weight of the alum will change the Fs and Bl, but these are also changed by cone material and mass, former, coil size, suspension. So if all that is the same, and just the coils are different, the weight difference is so minimal, that it has barely any noticeable change on an RTA, let alone the human ear. I understand doing copper coils is a mass issue, causing a lower Fs, but even if you weigh all components, and add mass difference from coppers weight to aluminums weight, the alum still has a higher Fs Average aluminum coil sub I build, whether its a single spider or quad spider ranges from 36-45hz Fs Copper coils I use, same height, 2" comparable gauge single to quad spider is from 20hz to 30hz I have a bunch of copper clad coils, for me these coils work best in all aspects, but the price is crazy on custom orders copper clad keeps the characteristics of aluminum usually, over copper Since I build speakers on my own now, I need to do my own testing, over testing for someone else like I used to Quote I have a ritual called "terminator". I crouch in the shower in the "naked terminator" pose. With eyes closed I crouch for a minute and visualize either Arnie or the guy from the 2nd movie. I then start to hum the T2 theme. Slowly I rise to a standing position and open my eyes. It helps me get through my day. The only problem is if the shower curtain sticks to my terminator leg. It sorta ruins the fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzleyadams69 Posted August 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 well i dont even know what fs and bl means and what role they play in a subwoofers sound. could someone explain for me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jville140db Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I've always tested my copper coils at a lower temp than alum right after high powered burps. And yes, the lower weight of the alum will change the Fs and Bl, but these are also changed by cone material and mass, former, coil size, suspension. So if all that is the same, and just the coils are different, the weight difference is so minimal, that it has barely any noticeable change on an RTA, let alone the human ear. but it does have to do with coils most alum coils are will have more resistance which means they are prone to power build up and most are flatwind coils which will have a smaller gap than the round copper so therefore the alum will and could peak easy due to power build up and smaller gap and the copper should handle more power given the material but may have a more linear response due to the how fast the electrical power can respond through the coil and the fact that their is a slightly bigger gap at some points in the coil windings Quote Car is 2010 Scion Tc Currently in car Deck- Sony XAV-60 in-dash mobile video system Speakers- Rockford Punch 6.5in comps in the front and coax in the rear Subs- 2 Gen 3 Rockford P3 12's dual 4 ohm Amps- Rockford P1000-1bd and P400-4 Alpine Mrp-f300 is in for P400-4 which is out to service Wiring- all rockford nuff said Enclosure- Dual 12in custom box by SRQ Battery- Optima Yellow top with big 3 done Sound Damping- All Dynamat products 1-2 layers throughout with liner on top Link to my build log- http://down4sound.co...=newpost&t=5275 Link to my youtube- http://www.youtube.c...ser/Jville140db MECP Advanced CEA # 110531 BassBox 6 Pro for Box Building/Re audio box calculator If you can hear the passenger it aint loud enough!!!!!!! QUOTE (MickyMcD @ Sep 25 2009, 07:25 PM) "My system has 30 speaker terminals, that means shits wanging doggggg....."<!--QuoteEnd--></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHR Ed Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I understand doing copper coils is a mass issue, causing a lower Fs, but even if you weigh all components, and add mass difference from coppers weight to aluminums weight, the alum still has a higher Fs Average aluminum coil sub I build, whether its a single spider or quad spider ranges from 36-45hz Fs Copper coils I use, same height, 2" comparable gauge single to quad spider is from 20hz to 30hz I have a bunch of copper clad coils, for me these coils work best in all aspects, but the price is crazy on custom orders copper clad keeps the characteristics of aluminum usually, over copper Since I build speakers on my own now, I need to do my own testing, over testing for someone else like I used to The Fs range is what we have been seeing on our new TSS/T2000 subs, which all have copper coils. Aluminum just hasnt seemed worth it seeing as how our power handling and efficiency is exceeding what we targeted at. But I have not tested with Copper clad, or Titanium. I would be interested to see the advantages of these over the copper we use. What material cone does the SMD woofer use? I have played with Aluminum coil subs with carbon cones and I wasnt pleased with the SQ. Quote Ed Lester ShowtimeSPL Host Showtime Electronics Video MarketingMy old Build Loghttp://www.stevemead...08/#entry511451http://www.youtube.com/showtimespl 5 time dB Drag Finalist Last ride 2007 HHR, current dB 153.5 and bass race 149.4 dB. 153.0 dB on music New Ride, 2008 HHR SS. Build under way. Loudest score ever = 171dB 2009 dB Drag Racing, North American Points Champion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rose-Villian Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 The Fs range is what we have been seeing on our new TSS/T2000 subs, which all have copper coils. Aluminum just hasnt seemed worth it seeing as how our power handling and efficiency is exceeding what we targeted at. But I have not tested with Copper clad, or Titanium. I would be interested to see the advantages of these over the copper we use. What material cone does the SMD woofer use? I have played with Aluminum coil subs with carbon cones and I wasnt pleased with the SQ. I wanna Say the Same Material that is used now... Thats The way it Looked Quote WWW.OSGINDUSTRIES.COM I LOVE HATER'S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHR Ed Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 but it does have to do with coils most alum coils are will have more resistance which means they are prone to power build up and most are flatwind coils which will have a smaller gap than the round copper so therefore the alum will and could peak easy due to power build up and smaller gap and the copper should handle more power given the material but may have a more linear response due to the how fast the electrical power can respond through the coil and the fact that their is a slightly bigger gap at some points in the coil windings The copper coils and aluminum coils I was testing were both flatwound and of the same size. Both in the same motor so gap size was the same. All was equal except the coil material. The copper did peak in SPL at 2hz lower than the aluminum. and was .1 db louder. average over all tests. Copper does have better thermal conductivity than aluminum, but aluminum has a lower mass, which is supped to let it expel heat faster. I was thinking that the reason why my IR thermometer was reading aluminum as 5-10 deg hotter was because of the ambient air being more warmed up. But the impedance rise went up more on the second and third burps on the aluminum coil as compared to the copper. This is usually due to increased heat and electrical resistance and decreased efficiency and power. Quote Ed Lester ShowtimeSPL Host Showtime Electronics Video MarketingMy old Build Loghttp://www.stevemead...08/#entry511451http://www.youtube.com/showtimespl 5 time dB Drag Finalist Last ride 2007 HHR, current dB 153.5 and bass race 149.4 dB. 153.0 dB on music New Ride, 2008 HHR SS. Build under way. Loudest score ever = 171dB 2009 dB Drag Racing, North American Points Champion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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