MaxVolume Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 to add on what fasfocus missed... what time will the shop open? when is employee lunch? what color will your shop t shirts be? what brand air compressor for the shop? None of it matters except putting food on the table. Install institute = how to work on cars with a focus on electrical\audio work. Business school = how to start, staff, and build a business that sells enough of product A, B and C to generate a net profit worked for a shop that "did things right". Knowledgeable owner, cool team, and everyone determined to both save the customer money and go the extra mile for them..... shame they're not around anymore... worked for a shop that was greedy and twisted. Owner was hell to be around, customers were getting robbed blind on subpar equipment, and the work was fast and dirty. That shops been here since '89 and the owner has 7-8 fully custom rides with a mansion of a house. As far as i can tell, that place is going to be here a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philrab Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 worked for a shop that "did things right". Knowledgeable owner, cool team, and everyone determined to both save the customer money and go the extra mile for them..... shame they're not around anymore... worked for a shop that was greedy and twisted. Owner was hell to be around, customers were getting robbed blind on subpar equipment, and the work was fast and dirty. That shops been here since '89 and the owner has 7-8 fully custom rides with a mansion of a house. As far as i can tell, that place is going to be here a long time. I wish I could say I've seen an example from column A that stuck around, but they are exceedingly rare. The best work in my area is coming out of the garage of guys with a full time job that do this on the side cause they LOVE it, not because they're trying to make a living. Same reason I opened shop out of my own garage. If I make a couple grand a year doing side work, I'm plenty happy. That's a couple grand I can put into my car that isn't coming out of my own pocket, and hopefully I can make some fast friends and do some work I can be proud of in the process. I did an enclosure design for a local guy. I wasn't "officially" doors open at that point, had a lot going on, but offered to do the design work free of charge since he wanted to build it himself. I finished the design, shipped everything to him (WinISD plots, cut sheet, Google Sketchup file and screen caps, everything he needed to assemble it) he did one Hell of a good build based on my design, and came away VERY happy with it (initial test on less than optimal power, he said it had a great range and really impressive output.) The process of figuring out the design was what attracted me, and being part of the creative process. That's why I do it, cause I enjoy it whether it's my build or not. I won't say anyone shouldn't chase their dream, just have a backup plan. Especially in car audio, it is such a rougher industry than it was 10-15 years ago. 2015 Toyota Tacoma Build Thread 2007 Mazda 3; 5000K HID's, Kenwood Excelon KDC-X997, Infinity Reference 6.5 comps in front and coaxials in the rear doors, JL 320.4 four channel, Rab Designs built ported enclosure with an SA12, Kenwood monoblock, Redline Leater shift boot/e-brake boot/center console cover, JBR short shifter/shifter bushings/rear motor mount. Build Thread 1996 Mazda Miata: Kenwood Excelon HU, Alpine speaker in the doors, Clearwater (miata specific) headrest speakers. 1994 Mazda Protege: Kenwood Excelon HU, Infinity Reference 2 ways all around, 2x RF Punch 10's in ported boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jk13 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 A good installer should make 65k+ pretty easily at a decent shop on commission. We had guys in our last shop over six figures, but they had the talent and put in the hours to do it. We also had a good sales staff and brought in marketing vehicle fleets to work on during the slow months. i.e. 32 vehicles, all the same, pound them out until they're done. Batteries, shore power, amps, wireless mics, PA systems, 32" monitors in the back, wheels and tires, etc. If you stayed and worked, log your time and make truckloads of cash. I personally can't stand doing remote starts, but if you get fast at them they can be money makers too, so I still do them. As with anything don't be afraid to say no. There is a list of vehicles I won't do. As an installer you should negotiate for around 40% of shop rate as commission, plus a bonus structure for meeting monthly labor goals. If there are jobs that suck or are low profit on labor (set prices as a package, "free head unit install"<--- we never did that, it cheapens your labor force, etc.) negotiate for spiffs or have them adjust some product profit to labor. No reason to work for less than you're worth. For custom audio systems, $3-8k complete are the sweet spot for making money. Four channel, front components, rear coax, sub amp, simple custom box, maybe a bit of fg or bondo shaping, big 3, and get it gone in a day or two. Big systems tend to bog down the shop and customers will always come in wanting to change something you've already started before you get it done. I don't own a business for many reasons, but #1 is get your liability insurance right before you touch anything. Had a buddy start a PDR business years ago and the first client he had was a Mercedes with the dual-pane glass. Nothing like working your first month to get back to even after breaking a $1500 window. If you can't afford business liability insurance, you can't afford to run without it either. BTW he's doing just fine now 15 years later. If you do step into ownership, don't forget health insurance, retirement, shop equipment maintenance and scheduled replacement, breakages, and paying for your employees' mistakes with free upgrades or buying new parts for cars, etc. It's a lot to deal with and all my friends that were business owners and aren't anymore only have one thing to say--they wish they had done it earlier. Like Phil said, it's a different industry now. If you can stay independent and get hooked up with working as a consultant or contracted labor, that may be a good way to go. Static drops are my bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philrab Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Like Phil said, it's a different industry now. If you can stay independent and get hooked up with working as a consultant or contracted labor, that may be a good way to go. That's actually one really good angle. You mentioned earlier how some shops (figure the ones that do lots of small jobs) get bogged down with big custom jobs. Step in, make friends with them, show them your work, and offer to work under their banner if they get something big in and need a hired gun to provide that extra pair of hands. Think outside the box too. The two local shops that have been around forever have moved their operations in different directions to keep the doors open. Shop A does a lot of work with local dealerships for remote starts, tint, ect. They negotiate a package deal for dealer installed options, drop X cars off a month, pay for the work. That's the money that keeps the shop open, and car audio is the gravy now. They also branched out into home audio. Shop B has dropped a lot of the custom work they used to do, deal in a couple of popular brands and several brand X that are cheaper/more margin, and just do a LOT of little business to stay afloat. Both had to change to survive the shrinking industry. Two really badass shops closed doors because they didn't want/couldn't change (one in particular did amazing custom installs, but when the industry turned they just closed the doors rather than change who/what they were.) 2015 Toyota Tacoma Build Thread 2007 Mazda 3; 5000K HID's, Kenwood Excelon KDC-X997, Infinity Reference 6.5 comps in front and coaxials in the rear doors, JL 320.4 four channel, Rab Designs built ported enclosure with an SA12, Kenwood monoblock, Redline Leater shift boot/e-brake boot/center console cover, JBR short shifter/shifter bushings/rear motor mount. Build Thread 1996 Mazda Miata: Kenwood Excelon HU, Alpine speaker in the doors, Clearwater (miata specific) headrest speakers. 1994 Mazda Protege: Kenwood Excelon HU, Infinity Reference 2 ways all around, 2x RF Punch 10's in ported boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jk13 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Like Phil said, it's a different industry now. If you can stay independent and get hooked up with working as a consultant or contracted labor, that may be a good way to go. That's actually one really good angle. You mentioned earlier how some shops (figure the ones that do lots of small jobs) get bogged down with big custom jobs. Step in, make friends with them, show them your work, and offer to work under their banner if they get something big in and need a hired gun to provide that extra pair of hands. Actually not my idea, the guy that took over as manager when I left does that now. I will say that if I didn't work in the shops I've worked at, I would not have the knowledge base I do now. Going out as an independent when I first started would not have been a good idea. When I talk about "talent" I don't just mean fabrication skills. Knowledge of 12 volt systems and their potential failure points is far more valuable. You can build the coolest looking vehicle on the planet but if it doesn't work it's useless. You can waste an incredible amount of time chasing gremlins, whether they're caused by you or someone else. Knowing where they will most likely be will determine profitability in most cases. I recommend hooking up with a good shop as an installer, hone those skills, and in 10 years if you still want to be a babysitter business owner, make that decision then. At least you'll know the best way to do things and you can train your staff to do it the way it should be done. Static drops are my bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeenGreenAudio Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 i want to say thanks to all the people that put something on this thread i really did think about it over the weekend and i like the 4 yr collage and 23 week program at II thanks alot guys it really means alot to me. Its hard at my school when a teacher asks what are u going to be doing in 5 years and my answer is "car audio installer". in the mean time im going to be going to some shows, now i am very new to this so how do u guys find local shows and where is the next big show at, gotta balance money for subs and school but ill have a system for sbn hopefully 2 team sundown 15s on some good power, currently however im having electrical issues and I need to troubleshoot that before anything bigger goes in the suburban. Once again guys thanks its hard to find true bassheads that really want to help other people everybody that posted something your all welcom at Meen Green Audio when i open the shop............... in like 7-10 years lol -Wesley Combs Build Log 1996 chevy suburban 2 zv4 15 kenwood excelon mids and tweeters kenwood excelon deck mevhman 370 3 batts all different mechman avmb II 2 inch squat 33 inch muds straight pipes kixker zx series 4ch sundown amps memphis 0 gauge soon to be fu audio c pillar wall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philrab Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 i want to say thanks to all the people that put something on this thread i really did think about it over the weekend and i like the 4 yr collage and 23 week program at II thanks alot guys it really means alot to me. Its hard at my school when a teacher asks what are u going to be doing in 5 years and my answer is "car audio installer". in the mean time im going to be going to some shows, now i am very new to this so how do u guys find local shows and where is the next big show at, gotta balance money for subs and school but ill have a system for sbn hopefully 2 team sundown 15s on some good power, currently however im having electrical issues and I need to troubleshoot that before anything bigger goes in the suburban. Once again guys thanks its hard to find true bassheads that really want to help other people everybody that posted something your all welcom at Meen Green Audio when i open the shop............... in like 7-10 years lol -Wesley Combs Then I'll wish you good luck man. Work your ass off, be careful out there, and love what you do. Just do yourself a solid favor and have a backup plan in case things go south or the industry tanks completely so you don't wind up completely screwed. Years back, I had several years in an industry, had progressed very quickly up through skill levels/certs/positions, and was sitting solidly as an Operations Manager. I made the decision to go back to college (60 hours a week and full time student suck very badly BTW) for business management. At the time, i figured I'd learn some skills I didn't have, move into a GM position eventually, and be set. As it happened, I graduated, moved into a GM position, then two years later the company hit hard times and downsized and my ass was out the door. I then took a job in a completely different industry (Aviation wasn't looking too good), and am starting over basically. My business degree and job skills got me this job, and I'll make up what I lost in pay eventually. Point is, had I stopped where I was and NOT gone back to school, I would have been in very rough shape when I lost my job, no telling where I would have ended up. Plan for things to go wrong, better to be pleasantly surprised when things go right than to be hosed when things go bad. 2015 Toyota Tacoma Build Thread 2007 Mazda 3; 5000K HID's, Kenwood Excelon KDC-X997, Infinity Reference 6.5 comps in front and coaxials in the rear doors, JL 320.4 four channel, Rab Designs built ported enclosure with an SA12, Kenwood monoblock, Redline Leater shift boot/e-brake boot/center console cover, JBR short shifter/shifter bushings/rear motor mount. Build Thread 1996 Mazda Miata: Kenwood Excelon HU, Alpine speaker in the doors, Clearwater (miata specific) headrest speakers. 1994 Mazda Protege: Kenwood Excelon HU, Infinity Reference 2 ways all around, 2x RF Punch 10's in ported boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RainStryke Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 You should look at getting a business degree if you want to eventually run a shop of your own and if your mind changes, it's a degree that many companies like to see if you are seeking employment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philrab Posted October 20, 2014 Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 You should look at getting a business degree if you want to eventually run a shop of your own and if your mind changes, it's a degree that many companies like to see if you are seeking employment. I'd ammend this by saying a Business degree in conjunction with industry skills/knowledge is very helpful. A business degree without any relavent experience is a rough market to be in (office drone, till you learn all the shit you do in a job/industry). Hence, when I paired my business degree/education with ten years of aviation knowledge, I was a very strong candidate. Now that I'm in a Finance/Payroll position, my experience at that last job doing timekeeping/budgetting/responding to RFP's/bidding for contracts gave me the background to get where I am now. If you want to open a shop, business degree OR a partner with that knowledge is going to be all but mandatory. If you end up having to abandom ship and go to work for someone else, having other markettable skills will be the difference between finding employment and losing everything. 2015 Toyota Tacoma Build Thread 2007 Mazda 3; 5000K HID's, Kenwood Excelon KDC-X997, Infinity Reference 6.5 comps in front and coaxials in the rear doors, JL 320.4 four channel, Rab Designs built ported enclosure with an SA12, Kenwood monoblock, Redline Leater shift boot/e-brake boot/center console cover, JBR short shifter/shifter bushings/rear motor mount. Build Thread 1996 Mazda Miata: Kenwood Excelon HU, Alpine speaker in the doors, Clearwater (miata specific) headrest speakers. 1994 Mazda Protege: Kenwood Excelon HU, Infinity Reference 2 ways all around, 2x RF Punch 10's in ported boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorboat KER Posted October 20, 2014 Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 because running a successful business is more work than anything. everyone I know whonowns their owj business works 70 hours a week plusif it is something you love it isn't work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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