overpowering and proper enclosures

[LoudBimmer]

Here's the big question.

What's is the difference between:

Running a 12" 600 wrms subwoofer on let's say 1800wrms in a really small box

compared

Running a 12" 1800wrms subwoofer on 1800wrms in proper enclosure.

I did this comparison with my SA's on 1200wmrs and 2500wrms.

With 1200wrms it moved decent amount of air and hit the low notes nicely.

With 2500wrms and tiny box the port moved insane amount of air. Could probably break a glass bottle Wasn't too great on low notes.

So what is exactly the benefits of overpowering a sub compared to using more powerful subwoofer?

[ROLEXrifleman]

there's two different issues you have to contend with b4 you see driver failure

thermal and mechanical

thermal will occur when you power a driver with more power than it can handle, even if it's clean, for a prolonged period of time

mechanical occurs when a driver isn't able to keep it's cone linear

sealed enclosures allow the mechanical portion to be kept in check thus allowing the driver to be driven with "more" power than rated. But even then there is a limit to how much more power you can use.

In ported boxes drivers do not have the added suspension that a sealed box provides thus the air space used must be kept in check. to much air space with too much power will cause the driver to mechanically fail

If you go sealed it's generally noted that more power can be applied while the larger above the box specs in a ported set up would require a reduction in power.

[ROLEXrifleman]

now if your asking why one would be chosen over another, that's purely up to someones musical taste

[LoudBimmer]

Considering that the ported enclosure will be used, will the small box and overpowering the sub move more air that more powerful subwoofer in normal enclosure and running rated power?

[ROLEXrifleman]

the air it moves will be based on the port area.

Given the same box, with the same sub but powering at XXX or YYY the only thing that will change is the port Velocity, not the amount of air being moved

[Joe X]

The 600W sub on 1800W in a small box will cook I guess.

Now to get some meaningful results on a test you need to move one variable at a time and have a way to make accurate measurements, if you change two or more variables you results are just going to confuse you more.

As a general statement the box adds stiffness to the sub's own, the smaller box adds more stiffness than the large one, the better way to give you an idea of what box size does is with modeling software like the free WinISD.

[skittlesRgood]

Considering that the ported enclosure will be used, will the small box and overpowering the sub move more air that more powerful subwoofer in normal enclosure and running rated power?

lets look at this from a different angle. a larger box is more efficient, needing less power for the sub to move further. a smaller box is less efficient, needing more power to move the sub the same amount. now the question might be, what method gets you louder. well that's completely situation based. what method is best for you depends on your goal. if you want a daily system the larger box will need less power, so less money on amps and electrical, and have a larger bandwidth. if you want a burp box for competition then you might do well with a small box and a large port. it'll be a "one note wonder" but it should get pretty loud.

[Karkov]

Regardless of results I would choose the proper enclosure, proper power, and personal preference of subs before I would go with a small sealed box and over power it. mainly the overpowering it a ton is why I would choose the option i did. $.02

Not saying that's right or wrong.

Also, there is always a safe way to get the results you want so you might as well go safe then over power...

[skittlesRgood]

Regardless of results I would choose the proper enclosure, proper power, and personal preference of subs before I would go with a small sealed box and over power it. mainly the overpowering it a ton is why I would choose the option i did. $.02

Not saying that's right or wrong.

Also, there is always a safe way to get the results you want so you might as well go safe then over power...

he never said anything about a sealed box...

if he wants a loud burp box then going "safe" isn't the goal. loud is the goal.

[bbeljefe]

I prefer to overpower the driver, be it a sub or a mid. Tweets... maybe a little bit.

My reasoning is that the amplifier will not be taxed as much and thus, will be more efficient, have more control over piston movement and in the end will provide more sound quality along with more volume because there is less chance of distortion. And if we assume that the enclosure is properly vented, the chances of thermal failure are reduced because the sub is able to cool much as possible. And cooling is not something that should be left on the back burner as a consideration.

A lot of to do is made of acoustical suspension with respect to sealed boxes vs ported boxes and there's no doubt that ported boxes provide better cooling along with some level of presumably much needed acoustical suspension, especially when overpowering subs. However, after the small amount of work I've done with transmission lines, I find that reasoning to be flawed to some degree.

A properly designed t-line provides next to no acoustical suspension for the driver (relative to a ported box) but, it also allows for the most cooling one could provide outside of free air. And with that said, I've run a 350 wrms sub on 1000 watts with no ill effects and no mech max issues, so I have to think that cooling plays an enormous amount into that equation... much more than one would normally think.

I've also run an SA-15 in a t-line on over three times rated and am currently running two Zv3-15s on about double rated and I haven't had the first problem. So again, in my experience, cooling is the key coupled with giving the amp a lot of headroom.