Thought Provoking: Existence of Free Will Under Imposition

[IH8PunkRok]

Was listening to Tool's "Rosetta Stoned" and a lyric got me thinking.

The lyric goes

"You are the Chosen One, the One who will deliver the message. A message of hope for those who choose to hear it and a warning for those who do not."

Now it made me start thinking about how I would feel under those circumstances. Not being the chosen one, but rather one of those who hears the message. I imagine the message would say something close to "Do all that I say or die."

At that point I began to ask myself, is that really a choice?

I want you guys to tell me your thoughts on this. Someone tells you "your choice, do everything I say or I kill you" at this point do you still have free will?

I imagine there will be two sides to the argument

1. Yes you have free will because you can choose to die and not live in a world you wouldn't want to.

OR

2. No you do not have free will because neither choice would be one you make outside of the given situation. The choice is irrelevant because it is merely a lesser of two evils, both are probably something you would never willingly choose.

Debate. I am interested to see thoughts on this

[EP95]

Yes, I have a choice. Kill the guy trying to kill me.

[Pasta Prime]

I feel that is not free will at all. When the only choices given to you are not your own, then that is not free will.

[SnowDrifter]

No, it's not free will.

"Do what I say or die" - living under someone who will impose their will under threat of death is not free will

However... That doesn't mean that living in a society with rules, regulations, and punishments is not freedom. IDEALLY those laws would be made made to protect people and allow a reasonable means of enforcing them. Different than living in a dictatorship scenario and threat of death as described above.

[hispls]

If you don't have principals and values for which you would willingly lay down your life you are already dead and your life is of no use or consequence to anyone. /THREAD

[finkster]

The song is about him being on acid. I understand you are only going over one line of the song but the point is that he was supposed to deliver a message but he forgot a pen.

That said, the line you are referring to may not be so much a threat of violence but a message that we may be destroying ourselves and they are trying to help.

[finkster]

PS Tool lyrics are often interwoven with different meaning and are generally regarded as pretty complex.

If it weren't for the internet, most of us would never have discovered the prevailing use of the Fibonacci sequence in Lateralus.

[IH8PunkRok]

The song is about him being on acid. I understand you are only going over one line of the song but the point is that he was supposed to deliver a message but he forgot a pen.

That said, the line you are referring to may not be so much a threat of violence but a message that we may be destroying ourselves and they are trying to help.

That second part I find really interesting. As ever it is all a matter of perspective. Take an addict for example. They are destroying themselves but they enjoy it. So something like an intervention would be seen as an imposition of their values upon the addicted. At what point does the line between control and aid exist?