Not impressed with current alternator technology :-(

[Fish Chris]

That sucked ! My post got moved to a different forum section, and I thought it got deleted ! Just by chance I found it again.

Alright, for starters, in case you hadn't already figured this out, I don't know shit about alts.... So it's not going to do much good to sit there and tell me, "Dude ! You don't know shit" ! I mean.... DUH ! LOL

I posted this to try to learn a few things.

And I still contend, that if a guy has to use more than 1 alt, that company is not making powerful enough alts.

Somebody said a 1200 amp alt would only fit in a train ? Yet four 300 amp alts can be squeezed under the hood of a Chevy Tahoe ??? Somebody explain to me why that is ?

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Another thing which I know NOTHING about, but want to learn, is what are the major differences in making AC and DC current ? I was checking out these gas generators earlier, which make 18Kwts, but they are for 120/240 volt AC systems. I learned that converting AC to DC is... well, sloppy.... but couldn't a generator produce straight up DC current to begin with ? If so, drop the gas motor, frame, wheels, fuel tank, etc... and what you have left is a piece of machinery that is basically, a large alternator. Probably not much bigger than a basketball, and maybe 75 to 100 lbs. Now use your vehicles motor to turn it. Who cares if it takes 20 or 30 HP. We are not building a race car here, right ? Okay... maybe a bass race It won't fit under the hood ? So what, I have a 6ft bed, and a bedcover. Somebody said something about belts ? Forget belts. Gears, and shafts.

Another thought (depending on the whole AC / DC thing) slap one of those generators (I guess only in a truck, with a covered bed.... or maybe in the back of an SUV if it could be seperated / isolated) as is ! They advertised that 18Kwt generator only had a noise level of 76 db's..... which I don't think you would hear over 160, huh ?

Sure this is all crazy talk. What, SM's 20 and 30Kwts systems are not crazy, too ?

And again, I'm not saying I'm going to do this, I'm just curious why some crazy, over the top guys like SM haven't done this ?

So anyway, I'm listening.....

Peace,

Fish

[Boon]

Yes there is SOME proprietary stuff going on but nothing you can't buy off the shelf if you're willing to pay the licensing for these ICs. Point is high output 12v alternators are much more of a niche product.

And there in lies the crux of the problem

That's like saying anyone can go and buy a re-wound stator and specced-up rectifier and build a HO alt. It's the little things that make them tricky

For Fish Chris, do some research on power generation, especially by spinning rotor inside a stator. As the rotor passes through the coil the voltage varies depending on how much of it is inside the field - if you model the voltage vs. time you'll find you get a sine wave, in other words AC.

Converting AC to DC is pretty easy, you can convert enormous amounts of AC to DC without too much difficulty. Hell our amps all do it

[brewer_brewer]

here is a great example of a great alternator setup for huge amounts of amps.

alma gates the grandmother of spl.

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2124933/3

[Torres]

And I still contend, that if a guy has to use more than 1 alt, that company is not making powerful enough alts.

did you not read the posts up at the beginning? simply put...they CANNOT just run one. many factors come into play as to why they cannot run that big of an alt

[Thewes]

Afetrmarket costs more because they have higher quality and thus higher priced parts than OEM.

OEM's are design to work just right with the factory electrical, thats it. You want more amperage, get something designed for that purpose.

Is that so? Because there have been several threads where people have caught multiple "aftermarket" alternator companies(not mentioning names either...) not altering the mechanical components of the alt at all. There are only a few after market alt companies I trust, one of them being DC power. I still dont know why Steve endorses other alt people that are borderline crooks. Fuck it to each his own.

[Guest DC Power Kyle]

It's technically easier to create high voltage with lower current(AC Power) rather than low voltage with high current(DC Power)

Think of it as your amps... the lower the resistance the harder and less efficient it is with your amps and the more power it needs... its because more amperage is needed to push through the amp to the speakers.

It's all about being able to get rid of the heat of the components inside. There are some nasty alternators out there, but many engines simply cannot turn them. Like someone said before me it takes power to make power.

The reason why generators can push a lot more power is because there is less amperage having to be created.

[Soulman07]

Is that so? Because there have been several threads where people have caught multiple "aftermarket" alternator companies(not mentioning names either...) not altering the mechanical components of the alt at all. There are only a few after market alt companies I trust, one of them being DC power. I still dont know why Steve endorses other alt people that are borderline crooks. Fuck it to each his own.

That is true, you have to do your homework on alternators or the companies based off of reviews. The stator in the alternators is probably the most expensive component I've come across. because of the copper grade and amount of it. A smaller pulley is really all that's needed to make an alternator put out more amps at idle based off of engine idle RPM.

You won't find any company that manufactures more than roughly 300-350ish amps of power per alternator I don't think. Most of the 300 amp units run a bit warm and can heat up with the engine bay pretty good in the process of it all, with the excess heat that isn't being dissipated. I'm sure you lose a bit of your amperage as well.

I'm running a single 300 amp unit I had built by a company called quality power. I haven't had it dyno'd yet but with around 6000ish watts of power and 3 group 31 batterys. On longer bass notes I only dip to around 14.6 from 15.3. At idle it puts out around 190amps and I dip into the 13's at full tilt and the cars resting voltage is 13.3. So it does it's job pretty well while driving. Kind of suprised me too actually. I figured it'd be dipping quite a bit lower.

Only options for that kind of power is to daisy chain a few alternators together and get it done that way though. Even then your car will probably sound like a turbine if they have external fans on them.

[Boon]

It's technically easier to create high voltage with lower current(AC Power) rather than low voltage with high current(DC Power)

AC and DC aren't always that way around... look at lightning, that's extreme DC voltage with hardly any current... and made just by rubbing some clouds together

[Fish Chris]

quote]

AC and DC aren't always that way around... look at lightning, that's extreme DC voltage with hardly any current... and made just by rubbing some clouds together

[

Yea'...... but then look at who makes it

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Hey seriously though, one thing I want to kind of change my position on is the cost of a specialty alternator. I know these are niche products, and with a lot fewer being sold, they definately need to charge more to pay for R and D. Then, if its a reputable company who is actually using better, more costly parts, that is going to bump up the cost some more.

That said "cost" is apparently not much of a concern for some guys. Look at the cost of SM's 4 alts.... and the rest of that setup ! I bet if he could have gotten a single "energy producer" that did the same job (or better) he wouldn't have thought twice about spending a $2000 on it ! (since his setup probably cost more than that anyway).

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One more thing for you guys to ponder;

I ran across a gas generator last night..... I think it was rated for 10Kwts. Costed about $1200. (and that $1200 included a gas motor, frame, wheels, gas tank, etc) Sure, it was primarily setup up for AC @ 120/240 volts. However, it was also cabable of making 450 amps, at 12 volts.

This tells me, that the technology is out there. I contend that too many people will always just look straight ahead..... and never question "why" is it done this way ? Why can't it be done somehow else ?

Don't be scared ! Step away from that "follow the leader" mentality. Sometimes even a dummy like myself will come up with some amazing stuff, simply because he had no "pre-set" beliefs about how things "have to be".

Peace,

Fish

[Stephen]

One more thing for you guys to ponder;

I ran across a gas generator last night..... I think it was rated for 10Kwts. Costed about $1200. (and that $1200 included a gas motor, frame, wheels, gas tank, etc) Sure, it was primarily setup up for AC @ 120/240 volts. However, it was also cabable of making 450 amps, at 12 volts.

This tells me, that the technology is out there. I contend that too many people will always just look straight ahead..... and never question "why" is it done this way ? Why can't it be done somehow else ?

and how big was the generator portion of the unit? no way you will fit that under the hood.