MrSoundz Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 i think that there is quality old school stuff out there. However, today's technology has caught up in terms of quality particularly when 95% of the car audio stuff today is outsourced. Honestly speaking if I found a mint condition old school amp that I know and it has been proven to stand the test of time then I would run with that. The problem is that class A/B today is supposed to be better than class A/B in earlier times. To be honest, some of the best sounding systems I ever heard came from older car audio equipment. Some of the harder hitting systems I heard came from the newer car audio equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skullz Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 http://www.teamrocs.com/technical/pages/classd.htm 01 Ford focus ZX3 Pioneer AVH-X491BHS PPI PC 4800.2 Morel Maximo 6.5" x2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cr@sh Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 I'm sorry, but... what?Wha....at? No, just no. A sub will only move like crazy with no volume if the output drive is fucked or the filter section is faulty. I've scoped large numbers of Class A, Class A/B and Class D amps and no, class D amps don't output random shit that will make some old high-sensitivity woofer jitter around like crazy. And as for modified sine, again, what the hell. No. Go stick a scope on the output of a Class D amp playing a 50hz sine wave and I DEFY you to show me the difference between that and the output of a Class A or Class A/B amp. That post in general...hrmmrmmrmrm. :01nocomment8so: :01nocomment8so: EDIT: Sorry to get my asshole hat on but IMO that's straight up misinformation :S This is one time I will definetly agree with boon(Which is rare! lol) I am all about class A/tube/AB amps becuase I like clean power but I am willing to bet I couldnt tell the difference by EAR between 0.004 THD and 1.0 Infact I read in CarStereo review years ago that (and I believe it was Dave Navone) who stated that the human ear could not hear the difference between 1.0 and 4.0 THD That was based on tests they did with random people and Audiophiles! My old install at cardomain, never finished! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickyMcD Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 A number of posts in this thread are written by people that have no clue. 1.) Myth; Concert loudspeakers make less hz. Fact; What the hell is making hz? Loudspeaker nomenclature>you. A 'car audio' woofer is usually capable of making bang-bang wobble-wobble noises up to around 120Hz and down to the mid to low 30Hz. For reference as I use them, Meyer PSW-2's make noises up to 200Hz from 28Hz (may not seem like a large difference, but remember your octaves), with a flat frequency response. 2.) Myth; Concert loudspeakers move less air Fact; What are we talking about here? The common perception that a high excursion woofer raping it's diaphragm back and forth is generating higher SPL, or by 'moving air' you are talking about general volume? I can push 120dB all day with two PSW-2's. Yes, many cars on this forum can do much more than that. Try 120dB CONSTANT at 50M mix position in a 1100 seat venue with vaulted ceilings. 3.) Myth; Class D (PWM, or Pulse Width Modulation) sounds bad on 'highs' and makes woofers 'go crazy' Fact; Get off the grass champ. You want to tell me that I can't throw a Powersoft K20 or Crown I-TECH on the high frequency section of a VDOSC? Well, it worked for the American presidential auguration. Many people forget that the range of a PWM device is limited by it's oscillation circuit. If the oscillator is a lower frequency, the highest factor of the oscillator frequency will be lower. The highest factor of the oscillator is your high end response. About making woofers 'go crazy.' Boon said it dead on; either the output section is cactus, the filter is upside down throwing its guts up or you haven't designed the system well and you have low end noise. 4.) Myth; Class A clean, class D Dirty Fact; That is a downright crock of shit. Sorry champ. Chances are your DAC's in your source device have a lower resolution than the output section of your PWM amplifier. Yes, you will not have a perfect sine wave output from a PWM output stage. You will have a wave made of 1,0 (on-off) steps. Any well designed PWM amplifier will have a resolution far higher than what you can detect with a 'Scope and, more importantly, your ears. 5.) Myth; Boon is a know-nothing Fact; What doesn't the guy know? I love heavy iron amps. Big ol' transformers, sagging power supplies, 200 kilo amp racks to make less than 20kW, and that's because I love the sounds they make. But I am sick and tired of people making a hypothesis on how something works, and preaching it as fact. Stop. Cheers, Mick Work;DiGiCo D1 Live / MIDAS Heratige 1000 / MIDAS VeniceMeyer Sound CQ-1's, CQ-2's, PSW-2'sRAMSA Monitor AmplifiersP.Audio MonitorsBSS OMNIDRIVE and SoundwebDBX 231 and Klark Teknik DN360 EQ'sRCF TT22ARCF ART320 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corrie32 Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 i guess he told you all i love this sh--t man 1966 Ford Fairlane Pioneer prs 80, the big three, with 2 big azz agm batts, dual 270/200 amp alts , two 8'' mids and tweets in the kick( PPI phantom 600.2). two 10''s and tweets in the doors, two 10'' mids and tweets in the rear decK ( Lanar opti 500x2). 2 C2 Audio Threatcon 4 12s on a Crunch GP3000d. No crossover . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Nemesis-DJ Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 Damn .....lots of funnies in here ...no real need to comment ...looks like Mick and Boon cleared most of it up // Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wL<3bass Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 Damn .....lots of funnies in here ...no real need to comment ...looks like Mick and Boon cleared most of it up // Thank god....all this misinformation being thrown around was pathetic... Vehicle: 1997 S10 Blazer 4dr 4X4 Exterior: Rear End Bagged, Black Grill, Lifted 2" Amplifiers: Rockford Fosgate T8004 & T10001bd Batteries: 2 Stinger SPV35, Kinetik HC2400 Electrical: Big 3, DC Power 290amp Alternator w/ MLA at 15.5v Enclosure: 4.2 ft³ @ 33Hz 84sq.in. of port (20sq.in. per cube) Headunit: Eclipse CD3200 w/ 80G iPod Mids/Highs: Rockford T152s (a-pillars), Rockford T162s (doors) Subwoofers: 1 15" Fi BL Fully Loaded Wire: All 1/0g Kicker Hyperflex My YouTube Videos My Fiberglass A-Pillar Build My "Seamless" Looking Box Build My DD1508 T-Line Bandpass Build "Seamless" w/ Acrylic Windows (for '05 TrailBlazer) My Stealth 8" Fiberglass Build (for '05 TrailBlazer) My Build For A Friend's '08 Cobalt 15" BL Sealed Off From The Trunk My feedback/references... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decaf Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 Damn .....lots of funnies in here ...no real need to comment ...looks like Mick and Boon cleared most of it up // o geez, lulz a knee slapper: makin bang-bang wobble-wobble noises its nice to have knowledgable guys on here... tooled is a tool evidently :01nocomment8so: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nirvalica Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 I run my setup on stock alt with a regular old battery. Haven't really had any problems. I'd prefer a HO alt, but don't have the money. Plus I may get a new car soon, so I don't wanna do too much to what I have. EDIT: also everything I run cost around $1000 total. My Youtube Page. Check it out The "SAV" - Sub-aural Assault Vehicle Kenwood eXcelon KDC-X993 Image Dynamics CTX 6.5" Components Q-logic 6.5" kick pods CDT 6.5" CL-E6NEO Front door Midbass Kicker ZX350.4 Knukonceptz SS Karma 4 channel 6m RCA Fi Q 18" w/ brushed aluminum dust cap 7cu ft. ported box tuned to 28hz Sundown SAZ-1000D Iraggi 240 amp Amputator Alt Big 3 in Monster 1/0awg Second Skin Damplifier Lite on roof and front doors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1030tooled Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 1.) Myth; Concert loudspeakers make less hz. Fact; What the hell is making hz? Loudspeaker nomenclature>you. A 'car audio' woofer is usually capable of making bang-bang wobble-wobble noises up to around 120Hz and down to the mid to low 30Hz. For reference as I use them, Meyer PSW-2's make noises up to 200Hz from 28Hz (may not seem like a large difference, but remember your octaves), with a flat frequency response. My correction, or should I say that I did not clearly state what I ment. What I ment was, that "in a closed field, a very small closed field(like a car/van) the reproduction of a woofer with a high sensitivity will have a narrower band of useable clean frequencies, compared to a woofer with a lower sens. and alot of excursion. Excursion is the KEY to making up the diffrence for the low sensintivity..........In a car............not venue. 2.) Myth; Concert loudspeakers move less air Fact; What are we talking about here? The common perception that a high excursion woofer raping it's diaphragm back and forth is generating higher SPL, or by 'moving air' you are talking about general volume? I can push 120dB all day with two PSW-2's. Yes, many cars on this forum can do much more than that. Try 120dB CONSTANT at 50M mix position in a 1100 seat venue with vaulted ceilings. Of all knowing you should know this. A woofer with high excursion is what I would use in a small venue with 1100 seat with walls. Not to mention how huge it would sound. High sensitive woofers would create to much reflection at the walls with a 12db gain,........you know this,....or should. Cancellation! 3.) Myth; Class D (PWM, or Pulse Width Modulation) sounds bad on 'highs' and makes woofers 'go crazy' Fact; Get off the grass champ. You want to tell me that I can't throw a Powersoft K20 or Crown I-TECH on the high frequency section of a VDOSC? Well, it worked for the American presidential auguration. Many people forget that the range of a PWM device is limited by it's oscillation circuit. If the oscillator is a lower frequency, the highest factor of the oscillator frequency will be lower. The highest factor of the oscillator is your high end response. About making woofers 'go crazy.' Boon said it dead on; either the output section is cactus, the filter is upside down throwing its guts up or you haven't designed the system well and you have low end noise. Very knowledgable indeed, but you are on a 12volt site, not a 220volt site. 4.) Myth; Class A clean, class D Dirty Fact; That is a downright crock of shit. Sorry champ. Chances are your DAC's in your source device have a lower resolution than the output section of your PWM amplifier. Yes, you will not have a perfect sine wave output from a PWM output stage. You will have a wave made of 1,0 (on-off) steps. Any well designed PWM amplifier will have a resolution far higher than what you can detect with a 'Scope and, more importantly, your ears. Not a perfect sine wave output, thanks for clearing that up! Class A = clean, class D =dirty 5.) Myth; Boon is a know-nothing Fact; What doesn't the guy know? Nobody is doughting that. I'm not, nor did I state it. I love heavy iron amps. Big ol' transformers, sagging power supplies, 200 kilo amp racks to make less than 20kW, and that's because I love the sounds they make. But I am sick and tired of people making a hypothesis on how something works, and preaching it as fact. Stop. Cheers, Mick 93' Ford Aerostar Alpine head unit 4-5.25 MB Quarts 20-10" pyramids super Pro 1 Lanzar amp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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