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DiBo

Wow... Our amps are junk! Regardless of what brand you're running.

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12 hours ago, White Lightning said:

I’ve been told similar information by my local repair technician here in Mississippi. I’m thinking shit like this is why he builds his own amplifiers. 

Guess you can’t help where parts are built, but it’s very nice to have someone that knows what he needs to make his amplifiers work and makes sure to buy the best of the best parts for his equipment to operate at maximum performance. Damn I love equipment Built in the USA !!!

Awhile ago I started a thread asking why old American amps were so much better. Now I know. I was under the impression that these internals were pretty good but I guess I was wrong. 

List of better parts...

  • Rubycon
  • United Chemi-Con (or Nippon Chemi-Con)
  • Nichicon
  • Sanyo/Suncon
  • Panasonic
  • Hitachi
  • FPCAP or Functional Polymer Capacitor (ex-Fujitsu caps segment, which was bought by Nichicon)
  • ELNA

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When I was in electronics, I was more into theories and principles rather than bran name component parts. Workin on a repair/ test bench Just wasn’t my thing. Now one thing I really enjoyed was the wiring aspect. Guess that’s what made me a cable broadband technician ... LOL

Edited by White Lightning

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We should be able to verify this ourselves...Open your amp up and look at the brands/part numbers on the components. Google them to research their origin. You could also call the amp company and ask about the origin of the components they use. I'm not saying that technician didn't know what he was talking about, but it's always good to verify information like this yourself instead of just taking someone's word and then passing it on directly.

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20 minutes ago, k58.cross said:

We should be able to verify this ourselves...Open your amp up and look at the brands/part numbers on the components. Google them to research their origin. You could also call the amp company and ask about the origin of the components they use. I'm not saying that technician didn't know what he was talking about, but it's always good to verify information like this yourself instead of just taking someone's word and then passing it on directly.

Ok, he heard about this in Nevada, I was told the same thing years ago in Mississippi. How could this be a coincidence ??? Doesn’t sound like one man’s opinion to me. Just Saying 

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It's plausible and I wouldn't be surprised. But there's a lot of amp companies out there. I'm saying check your own stuff and find out the real answer. You know what though, if we do find out specific amp companies are using inferior parts then by all means we should raise hell and spread the word and complain to the companies. Spending hundreds or even thousands for equipment that cost way less to produce should not be ok.

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I'm sure they would love to put higher grade components in.....then pass the buck along....then people will complain about the cost.....then they'll put cheaper components in....lower the price....then someone will complain about the quality of components.....repeat.......


2010 Accord Sedan

XS D3400R

Clarion HU

Sundown mids and highs

Incriminator amps

Incriminator Lethal Injection 12"

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On 1/22/2019 at 5:40 PM, DiBo said:

Talked to an amplifier repair person here in Las Vegas Nevada. This guy used to compete in the late 80s and now does a lot of high-end home audio. I won't go into brands but he told me that these caps and internals are Chinese junk. 50¢ a pop type junk. He told me that if I bring any amps to repair he puts quality internals. He said the samwa and capcion ( not sure if I spelled that right) is absolute garbage. he said he would use at minimal Panasonic caps at about $6.50 each and they're far superior that what we're getting. This dude just talked for 45 minutes about how bad we're getting duped lol. Korean amps but nothing but Chinese cookie cutter parts. I'm honestly not worried about it I'll still spend the money and I'll even spend extra for a certain name over another name because I like the brand better. It was just very interesting some of the stuff he had to say. Wow... 5000 watt boards for $239 ( but you have to order 50 and have your heat sinks made). He told me to stay away from the big ass 10000 watt boards and to stick with multiple 2 ,3,  and 4000 Watt boards hahaha. I just found a very interesting how knowledgeable he was. I thought I'd share some of his opinions hopefully not starting anything. 

"absolute garbage" (non specific, poor description, I'd rather hear why)

"late 80s" (30 years ago, times have changed... a lot)

"duped" (plenty of koreans do rated power, not sure how reliability and clean sine waves for a reasonable cost is 'duped')

"cookie cutter" (shared designs keep cost reasonable, ever wonder why Linear Power amps are so fucking expensive? No one else has Ray's board designs) 

So, what was his recommendation in terms of what board HE would buy?  I am dreadfully curious.

***

I agree with the staying away from big surfboards, repair techs dont want to take responsibility of a pricey ass board when you send it in for repair.  

I also have no problem paying someone a premium for putting up the money to place a 100 board order so that I can have a board that I can wire down to 1/3 ohm daily and never have a problem.  Thats what capitalism is all about (think about your battery venture versus JY's or Limitless's offering).

Are Rubycon, Panasonic, and Nichicon better components?  YES.  Are korean caps (samwha, capxon, and samyoung) good enough for bass boards? Absolutely.  Are korean caps better than chinese caps (yuscon, vent, and various no-names) in terms of ESR and tolerance over lifetime?  Yep, sure are.

Your local amp repair guy may have some opinions, but many of his statements are just that... opinions.  More than anything, he impressed you enough for you to go to him when your board breaks.

$0.02 :)

BTW, i agree with having nice, USA-made, high quality amps sporting Nichicon and Panasonic caps.  WalledSonic 3.0 is going to run a significant amount of classic old school wattage... 

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Fwiw, not very many things use the highest of highest quality parts compared to stuff like medical equipment & electronics operating under negative pressure ect..

  Sure, its nice to have a custom 10kw board with quality parts however, we know that there are levels to quality and through experience we can't say that sundown/hifonics/dd/boss all use the same level of quality caps because they aren't.

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I agree with what I was told. These companies aren't making amplifiers the way home audio makes their amplifiers. These amps blow all the time, even when used the way they should be. if you guys noticed I also posted that I will still be buying these amps, and that they are good enough for what we do with them. I also posted that I thought it was interesting what he had to say. When I was younger one of the things that turned me away from audio was the dollar a watt bush. Or at the time what I thought was Bush. we argue all the time about what amps are better than other amps but when you take them apart it's the same parts... Why would I spend 2000 plus dollars for a digital designs m series amp when I can spend $1,150 on an apocalypse deaf bonce amp that's basically the same thing. I have noticed that some of the cheaper amps do  use cheaper parts tho. When I compared amp A to amp B ,not only did I notice a different quality in the build of the amp, I actually did Google some of the parts, I saw the differences for myself. We're not allowed to do versus threads or I would have posted what I found. I sold a perfectly good 5000 watt board so I can spend even more money on a slightly more powerful Sundown Audio board. Just so I can match my amps to my subs. I've also taken apart a few other amplifiers and noticed that the s&i amplifier seem to be built a little bit better than the zennon built amplifiers. when I say built better I mean the seating of the components and the fastening of the components to the board is actually beefier on the S &I built amplifiers. I'm a different kind of consumer then the average guy out there... I do tons of research. lucky for us when we pop these amplifiers repairing them with more quality components isn't that expensive at all. 

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2 hours ago, WalledSonic said:

"absolute garbage" (non specific, poor description, I'd rather hear why)

"late 80s" (30 years ago, times have changed... a lot)

"duped" (plenty of koreans do rated power, not sure how reliability and clean sine waves for a reasonable cost is 'duped')

"cookie cutter" (shared designs keep cost reasonable, ever wonder why Linear Power amps are so fucking expensive? No one else has Ray's board designs) 

So, what was his recommendation in terms of what board HE would buy?  I am dreadfully curious.

***

I agree with the staying away from big surfboards, repair techs dont want to take responsibility of a pricey ass board when you send it in for repair.  

I also have no problem paying someone a premium for putting up the money to place a 100 board order so that I can have a board that I can wire down to 1/3 ohm daily and never have a problem.  Thats what capitalism is all about (think about your battery venture versus JY's or Limitless's offering).

Are Rubycon, Panasonic, and Nichicon better components?  YES.  Are korean caps (samwha, capxon, and samyoung) good enough for bass boards? Absolutely.  Are korean caps better than chinese caps (yuscon, vent, and various no-names) in terms of ESR and tolerance over lifetime?  Yep, sure are.

Your local amp repair guy may have some opinions, but many of his statements are just that... opinions.  More than anything, he impressed you enough for you to go to him when your board breaks.

$0.02 :)

BTW, i agree with having nice, USA-made, high quality amps sporting Nichicon and Panasonic caps.  WalledSonic 3.0 is going to run a significant amount of classic old school wattage... 

Those Korean caps aren't Korean at all. Chinese. These amps that are built in Korea are using 95% Chinese components. I don't have a problem with that, my Sundown subwoofers are 95% Chinese also. The batteries I'm producing or 100% Chinese. My fi subwoofers are 100% American and I'll still go with Sundown. And Fi is the home team for me! Lol. I've been in their shop. I seen them building their subwoofers.I know a few of the guys up there and I'm still going with Sundown. I just like the way the subwoofers sound a little bit better. Also like the availability of subwoofers and recones. I still  absolutely love Fi Audio products but just because they're made in America doesn't make them better then what the Chinese are doing. America hasn't been the best manufacturer of products in a long time imo. All across the world people innovate and then other people recreate. Everybody loves Apple iPhones... Invented in America but they are produced with Japanese and Chinese parts. 

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